Cellular Phone Forum / Providers / ATT Wireless / January 2008
Judge Immediately Bans Sale of Qualcomm W-CDMA Chips
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SMS 斯蒂文• 夏 - 04 Jan 2008 10:23 GMT "U.S. District Judge James Selna issued the ruling Monday, the latest in a series of legal victories Broadcom scored over Qualcomm last year related to rights to technology for cell phones. The three patented chips use WCDMA technology, a small but fast-growing part of the wireless market used mostly in American T-Mobile and AT&T phones.
Selna ruled that Qualcomm can continue to sell other disputed chips in the United States until January 2009, but must pay royalties on those chips, which use a different technology called EVDO and are used on Verizon and Sprint networks in America. He also allowed Qualcomm to use a patented Broadcom walkie-talkie technology until January 2009."
Broadcom and Qualcomm must be very far apart on settling. Reminds me of the whole RIM mess last year, but they settled eventually, as everyone predicted.
This whole patent dispute is one reason that W-CDMA didn't make it into the iPhone.
Ron - 04 Jan 2008 13:03 GMT YOu're posting old news. Qualcomm already announced new complaint chipsets
http://www.reuters.com/article/technologyNews/idUSN0262822220080102
On Fri, 04 Jan 2008 02:23:15 -0800, SMS ??? ? <scharf.steven@geemail.com> wrote:
>"U.S. District Judge James Selna issued the ruling Monday, the latest in >a series of legal victories Broadcom scored over Qualcomm last year [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] >This whole patent dispute is one reason that W-CDMA didn't make it into >the iPhone. That's a fiction about the iphone. It was a battery consumption and size issue.
SMS 斯蒂文• 夏 - 04 Jan 2008 14:09 GMT > YOu're posting old news. Qualcomm already announced new > complaint chipsets > > http://www.reuters.com/article/technologyNews/idUSN0262822220080102 I hope they're new chipsets are not complaint chipsets!
They're announced, but not available yet. It'll take a while for the chips to be manufactured, then designed into phones. It could easily take six months to see products with the new chips.
Broadcom will likely claim that the new chips still violate their patents.
jgrove24@hotmail.com - 05 Jan 2008 18:17 GMT On Jan 4, 8:09 am, SMS 斯蒂文* 夏 <scharf.ste...@geemail.com> wrote:
> > YOu're posting old news. Qualcomm already announced new > > complaint chipsets [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Broadcom will likely claim that the new chips still violate their patents. More reason to wait for the Google phone and the results of the analog TV bandwidth auctions. Don't buy a new phone this year !!
Bill Kearney - 05 Jan 2008 19:57 GMT > More reason to wait for the Google phone and the results of the analog > TV bandwidth auctions. Don't buy a new phone this year !! Eh, until they actually start deploying radio HARDWARE it's pointess to speculate. You can have all the superior technology you want, but if it doesn't have radios on poles covering areas you need then it's pointless. We ditched cingular for precisely this reason, their coverage just sucks in the places we need to go. Doesn't matter how good the phones are if the coverage sucks.
4phun - 06 Jan 2008 00:06 GMT On Jan 5, 1:17 pm, jgrov...@hotmail.com wrote:
> On Jan 4, 8:09 am, SMS 斯蒂文* 夏 <scharf.ste...@geemail.com> wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > More reason to wait for the Google phone and the results of the analog > TV bandwidth auctions. Don't buy a new phone this year !! Nah the iPhone is some much sheer fun you will miss out on a year of great stuff. Just sell it and get your money back when something better arrives.
Ness-Net - 06 Jan 2008 04:37 GMT > On Jan 5, 1:17 pm, jgrov...@hotmail.com wrote: >> On Jan 4, 8:09 am, SMS 斯蒂文* 夏 <scharf.ste...@geemail.com> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > great stuff. Just sell it and get your money back when something > better arrives. There is a fundamental flaw in your premise. The second that a 3G iPhone hits the market, EVERY EDGE iPhone immediately depreciates dramatically. Maybe not zero, but damn near. It is what I call a bad investment. Now, if you can afford buying toys and can afford buying another one in a year or so, then go for it...
Larry - 06 Jan 2008 05:36 GMT "Ness-Net" <no.richard@damnspam.nessnet.com> wrote in news:OP-dnV- Jjaiwxh3anZ2dnUVZ_gWdnZ2d@giganews.com:
> EVERY EDGE iPhone > immediately depreciates dramatically. Maybe not zero, but damn near. Ebay will be flooded...(c;
Why would Apple be so stupid as to make their customer base ANGRY at losing $600 or $500 or $400 in a few months? It's stupid.
Upgraded the whole Nokia N800 Linux tablet to the new OS2008, tonight. Took the plunge...(c; I may have gone overboard loading programs. It needs a 750GB hard drive...(c; The new map function is downloading 733MB of USA East maps, as I type this. They integrated a talking mapware right into the new OS2008 and GAVE IT TO US! Way cool....
Larry
 Signature Next time some broker tells you what a great investment he's selling, ask him about Rhodium, a shiny metal used in Catalytic Converters. Jan 1st 2004 2005 2006 2007 2008 Rhodium $452 $1341 $3006 $5339 $6775 PER OUNCE! How much longer can we pay for new cars at this rate? Feb '97 it was $182/oz
Bill Kearney - 06 Jan 2008 17:53 GMT > Why would Apple be so stupid as to make their customer base ANGRY at > losing > $600 or $500 or $400 in a few months? It's stupid. Apple is famous for screwing their exising bleeding edge customers. Why would they be any different this time? The Apple fanboys are so f.cking stupid. They'll probably come up with some silly a.s rationalization about how they were "helping" the company by going along with it. Cripes, it's practically the Stockholm syndrome.
IMHO IIRC - 06 Jan 2008 18:44 GMT >> Why would Apple be so stupid as to make their customer base ANGRY at >> losing [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > about how they were "helping" the company by going along with it. Cripes, > it's practically the Stockholm syndrome. They believe everything Steve Jobs says since he knows best.
Larry - 07 Jan 2008 00:05 GMT "IMHO IIRC" <NOSPAM@NOSPAM.NOSPAM> wrote in news:ck9gj.4156$M24.3994 @newsfe17.lga:
> They believe everything Steve Jobs says since he knows best. That can't be true because Billy Gates has more of nearly everything..... (c;
Apple is proof that Micro$oft isn't trying to conquer the world....(c; I think Apple amuses them.
Larry
 Signature As the price of Monopoly money rises, at some point it will equal Federal Reserve Private Bank fake banknotes in value!
clifto - 06 Jan 2008 20:23 GMT >> Why would Apple be so stupid as to make their customer base ANGRY at >> losing [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > how they were "helping" the company by going along with it. Cripes, it's > practically the Stockholm syndrome. As I recall, it was a mark of honor to have paid $10,000 for a Lisa and then to have gotten the letter (and pin) telling you that the computer they would henceforth be developing software for only cost $5,000.
 Signature Dec. 6 (Bloomberg) -- Government officials and activists flying to Bali, Indonesia, for the United Nations meeting on climate change will cause as much pollution as 20,000 cars in a year.
SMS - 06 Jan 2008 19:58 GMT <snip>
> There is a fundamental flaw in your premise. > The second that a 3G iPhone hits the market, EVERY EDGE iPhone > immediately depreciates dramatically. Maybe not zero, but damn near. > It is what I call a bad investment. Now, if you can afford buying toys and > can afford buying another one in a year or so, then go for it... First of all, don't assume that the 3G iPhone means no more EDGE iPhones. The monthly pricing on the 3G model will likely be higher, or you'll be able to have your choice of 3G or EDGE service at different price points. It isn't corporations buying iPhones, it's individuals that may be happy paying $20 less per month and having the lower speed.
Second, the judges ruling will delay the 3G iPhone in the U.S., as Qualcomm cannot sell their current chip design, and the cycle time to get new silicon into devices is long to very long, depending on how many revisions of silicon they need to go through. By the time the 3G iPhone hits stores, it'll be a year since the first model.
Third, company's really can't be too concerned that their newer products will hurt the resale value of their older products, nor do most purchasers expect the company to stop introducing new products.
Fourth, the current iPhone buyers purchased their iPhones knowing full well that a 3G model would be introduced, they just didn't know when. Very few will be really mad about it.
Finally, there's a tendency to dismiss all iPhone buyers as morons, based on Usenet posts in CSMA or the alt.cellular groups. It gives a really warped picture of the average iPhone user, who would be aghast and angry to be equated with the fanboys that post on Usenet. They knew the feature limitations when they bought it, and they're not spending time rationalizing the missing pieces. It's not a phone I would buy for a host of reasons, but those I know that them are happy with them for the most part. The biggest complaint is not the lack of 3G, it's the lack of voice-dialing.
Larry - 07 Jan 2008 01:23 GMT I'm the guy who wrote the "Liveaboard Simulator" for people thinking of moving their families aboard a sailboat to live. Google it and you'll find it in a lot of places. I never dreamed it would still be there years later.
In that same "simulator" idea, when someone asks me what I think of these big PDA phones or WebTV appliances like iPhone or Voyager, I tell them before they buy they need to try my "WebTV Phone Simulator" before making such a mistake and being stuck with it, besides being laughed at in public which is embarrassing.
So, Here is: The Pocket WebTV SELLphone Simulator
Before making a mistake and buying that big-screened WebTV appliance they've all been hyping on TV, internet and in the Bigboy Toy Stores, pick out the one you think you want to buy and go to its specification webpage such as: iPhone: http://www.apple.com/iphone/specs.html Verizon Voyager: http://www.voyager10000.com/ search Google for "iPhone clones" to find the others...
Now, note the physical dimensions and weight of your choice: iPhone: Size and weight * Height: 4.5 inches (115 mm) * Width: 2.4 inches (61 mm) * Depth: 0.46 inch (11.6 mm) * Weight: 4.8 ounces (135 grams)
Voyager: Weight - 4.69oz Dimensions - 4.64 x 2.12 x 0.71"
(You hunt for your particular choices physics.)
Now, find a little clear plastic box as near to those dimensions as you can. If you beg a little at a jewelry store, they'll probably give you one just to get rid of you fast, if you promise to never come back in those clothes.
If you don't have a letter scale, take the box and some coins or washers to the post office where they have really calibrated small scales right out where you can use them. Put the box on the scale and keep adding coins or washers until you come up to the new phone's weight. A little superglue setting up overnight on the coins EVENLY DISTRIBUTED inside the plastic box will provide the simulated weight.
Now that we have a faux fone for "testing", and the washers inside aren't rattling around attracting attention, clean off the "front" of your new fauxfone 5000 really good because that is going to be part of the test....keeping the screen clean while using it as a phone up against your sweaty cheeks. More on that later. We're ready to start the simulator to see how we like it.
We'll start by carrying around the fauxfone every place you carry around your current SELLphone, in the pocket you always carry the SELLphone in. Move the real SELLphone to another pocket during the simulation, so you can see how the new WebTVfone is going to feel and fit in your favorite pocket. If you currently wear your tiny SELLphone on a hip carrier on or in a nice carrying case on your belt, you can put that out of your mind and leave the SELLphone in its carrier. You won't be carrying an iPhone, with its large- target, fragile touchscreen, banging into the desks/copier/file cabinets/steering wheel/door frames/seat belt buckles/etc. for long before it's destroyed. These gadgets cannot take that kind of daily punishment. If you doubt this, superglue an old belt clip onto the back of the simulator box and carry it on your hip, putting the SELLphone in a pocket all week. See if the "screen" on the plastic box gets "scratched" or gouged while in simulation. This will also discourage you when you "feel" this huge box every time you jam it into your ribs upon entering your car or dropping into your favorite easy chair. The corners of an iPhone are more rounded than the simulator box...but not THAT much more.
Simple rules for simulation....
Every time you phone rings, answer it as you always do. Estimate how long you held it to your ear while being bitched out for your current infractions by "her" (in attack mode, which differs from simulator mode). When you hang up the little SELLphone and put it away, fish out the simulator box and put it to your ear, screen against your cheek, for approximately the same time as the real phone call. (You may, of course, delay doing this when the simulation might get you fired or divorced or sent to the drunk tank, but make the simulated "call" as soon as practical, once you're not standing in front of your boss' desk or "her" punishment area. If more calls come in too quick to use the simulator box, ADD the TOTAL TIME and simulate as soon as you can, even if it inconveniences you. (Noone can see you holding a stupid plastic box to your ear in a bathroom stall. You're stuck in there for some time, make good use of it dropping the stacked up simulator time slots.)
Every time you need to make a call, look closely at the simulator "screen" you'll be dialing on or at least looking at to see what you're dialing. At some point, even the most sedate of us is gonna grease up that "screen" to the point it needs more cleaning. It's inevitable! Clean it when it needs it, noting how this changes your day. Hold the box to your face and make the call right after you get off the phone, just like you did receiving calls.
Again, it's a good idea to be in discrete in simulation and not let important people see you "testing"....unless, of course, you notice OTHERS in simulation mode carrying around plastic boxes with washers glued into them! If you find other simulatees, you both should compare notes and share simulator stories, including simulator construction plans which lend themselves to field improvements for more realism.
OK, Day 1 is over and you're home. As you put your SELLphone down on the computer desk, lay down the simulator next to it with ONE LITTLE EXCEPTION.... WebTVfones being played with EAT BATTERIES during the day and MUST be recharged or we're not going to have SELLphone service tomorrow afternoon. Dig out an old AC power brick you used to charge the old flip phone with and lay it near an outlet by your desk. (No need to plug it in as simulators are "self-recharging" and last forever.) Lay the simulator on top of the phone end of its cable to simulate PLUGGING THIS BATTERY HOG INTO THE GRID EVERY NIGHT.
Ok, we'll let you run in simulator for a couple of weeks until the next big price retraction and inevitable rebate scheme on the one you want. If you still want it and save a hundred bucks because of my simulator holding you back a couple of weeks, you'll think of me every time you power up the accessory you bought with the extra hundred bucks to go with it.
Two Week Review.....
OK, two weeks have passed....
Question: Do you want to carry around the plastic box every place you need a SELLphone for the next TWO years of your contract?
Question: Do you think the plastic box would last 2 years, looking at all the gouges and scratches on the plastic box's simulated screen after only two weeks?
Question: Did you stomp and dump the plastic box in the trash any time during the last two weeks when it pissed you off sticking you in the gut or gouging the end of your nipples?
Question: Did anyone poke fun at you, directly, or seem to point and laugh in a public place just because you had an iPhone-sized plastic box to your face walking down the ramp?
These questions should help you make your own decision about the neat new WebTVfone you had in mind.....no matter who made it.
WAIT! Before rushing out waving that credit card, spend WEEK 3 carrying around JUST your trusty old flip or candy bar in that favorite pocket. Make the decision ONE WEEK AFTER passing on this simulator and your simulator box, if it survives, to the NEXT googly-eyed buyer you know.
Larry
 Signature NO IMPULSE BUYING YOU'LL REGRET FOR TWO YEARS!
-= Hawk =- - 07 Jan 2008 08:15 GMT >SELLphone The above idiocy negates any inherent usefulness of your post. You make yourself look like a moron.
Larry - 07 Jan 2008 22:02 GMT >>SELLphone > > The above idiocy negates any inherent usefulness of your post. You make > yourself look like a moron. Why? Because you do not like its truth?
Larry
 Signature As the price of Monopoly money rises, at some point it will equal Federal Reserve Private Bank fake banknotes in value!
-= Hawk =- - 08 Jan 2008 02:53 GMT >> On Mon, 07 Jan 2008 01:23:19 +0000, Larry <noone@home.com> >scribbled: [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > >Why? Because you do not like its truth? Why? Because you're trying to foist off some moronic catchphrase you think is cute and clever but in all honesty makes you look even more like an imbecile.
Elmo P. Shagnasty - 08 Jan 2008 04:24 GMT > >>>SELLphone > >> [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > think is cute and clever but in all honesty makes you look even more > like an imbecile. Maybe Larry is BUYsexual.
Larry - 08 Jan 2008 05:30 GMT > Why? Because you're trying to foist off some moronic catchphrase you > think is cute and clever but in all honesty makes you look even more > like an imbecile. First off, you must understand I don't give a sh.t if you like it or not.....
So, your choice is to simply killfile me, putting you out of your misery.
As Billy Connoly puts it, "f.ck Off!"....(c;
They are SELLphones. If they weren't, they would be hobbled, disabled and the smartphones would be smartphones, actually running programs....like your laptop does, without the company bureaucrats' permissions.
The term is very accurate. Ask any Verizon customer.
Larry
 Signature As the price of Monopoly money rises, at some point it will equal Federal Reserve Private Bank fake banknotes in value!
Elmo P. Shagnasty - 08 Jan 2008 05:42 GMT > First off, you must understand I don't give a sh.t if you like it or > not..... Which is why you live in these newsgroups, right?
Elmo P. Shagnasty - 08 Jan 2008 05:43 GMT > They are SELLphones. If they weren't, they would be hobbled, disabled and > the smartphones would be smartphones, actually running programs....like > your laptop does, without the company bureaucrats' permissions. > > The term is very accurate. Ask any Verizon customer. Very INaccurate. Ask any AT&T, T-Mobile, or Sprint customer.
When will you acknowledge that your VERY LIMITED experience in the world has nothing to do with reality?
Steve Sobol - 08 Jan 2008 05:45 GMT ["Followup-To:" header set to alt.cellular.verizon.]
> So, your choice is to simply killfile me, putting you out of your misery. > As Billy Connoly puts it, "f.ck Off!"....(c; One thing you haven't addressed is that you use some of the same services that, when someone else talks about using them, you make them sound like dumbasses.
You can't have it both ways.
> The term is very accurate. Ask any Verizon customer. As pointed out to you countless times, Verizon is the worst in this respect and is not representative of the entire industry.
 Signature Steve Sobol, Victorville, CA PGP:0xE3AE35ED www.SteveSobol.com Geek-for-hire. Details: http://www.linkedin.com/in/stevesobol
-= Hawk =- - 08 Jan 2008 10:42 GMT >> Why? Because you're trying to foist off some moronic catchphrase you >> think is cute and clever but in all honesty makes you look even more >> like an imbecile. > >First off, you must understand I don't give a sh.t if you like it or >not..... If you don't give a sh.t what keeps you coming back to my posts?
>So, your choice is to simply killfile me, putting you out of your misery. Or I could keep making fun of you and see what funny dances you'll do.
>As Billy Connoly puts it, "f.ck Off!"....(c; > >They are SELLphones. If they weren't, they would be hobbled, disabled and Only in your pea sized brain.
>the smartphones would be smartphones, actually running programs....like >your laptop does, without the company bureaucrats' permissions. If everything were the way it should be across the planet there'd still be some loser like you with something to whine about or some agenda he thinks other people give a sh.t for.
>The term is very accurate. Ask any Verizon customer. It, as I said, makes you look like a moron.
Now, I'm bored, polka for me, f.cker.
digi - 07 Jan 2008 14:59 GMT > <snip> > > > There is a fundamental flaw in your premise. > > The second that a 3G iPhone hits the market, EVERY EDGE iPhone > > immediately depreciates dramatically. Yeah, even though cell phones are notorious for depreciation, the iPhone will be the execption to the rule because its so cool?
> First of all, don't assume that the 3G iPhone means no more EDGE > iPhones. Youre right! they will probably keep it around much like they did the 4 gb iPhone. You know how they like to give customers choice!
>The monthly pricing on the 3G model will likely be higher, or > you'll be able to have your choice of 3G or EDGE service at different > price points. So does this mean ATT has to give SJ even more money per month now?
>It isn't corporations buying iPhones, it's individuals > that may be happy paying $20 less per month and having the lower speed. Right here, your making my next point for me! tia!
> Fourth, the current iPhone buyers purchased their iPhones knowing full > well that a 3G model would be introduced, they just didn't know when. > Very few will be really mad about it. The majority of current iPhone users DO NOT KNOW WHAT 3G is, much less know that the iPhone doesnt have it, and that is why they wont be mad about it. The majority of people in general, were told the iPhone was 246 devices in one, and hence beleive that it does EVERYTHING.
> Finally, there's a tendency to dismiss all iPhone buyers as morons,. > based on Usenet posts in CSMA or the alt.cellular groups. It gives a [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > the most part. The biggest complaint is not the lack of 3G, it's the > lack of voice-dialing. Just because the fanboys here are morons, doesnt make the normal iPhone users any less of morons. Atleast the fanboys know the device has weak points and are just able to spin it to work in their favor. The real deal average joe iPhone user doesnt even know about these shortcomings. There are three classes of iPhone users it seems, the fanboys which we see here all the time, we all know their level of intelligence. Then there is the blissful idiot iPhone user, who think they are part of some special clique because they use Apple products. These users are not technically motivated, think their phone does everything, and really have no idea the real features available on a modern day cell phone. These are also the users who own a macbook, and brag about how great it is to make movies on a mac, even though they have never once even had spark of thought in their simple mind that could ever be stretched into a film. Then there is the remorseful buyer iPhone user, who now knows all too well that he was robbed, not only of his hard earned cash on crippled, old, over-hyped technology, but also of his dignity because he was totally suckered.
SMS - 07 Jan 2008 16:26 GMT >> <snip> >> [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > about it. The majority of people in general, were told the iPhone was > 246 devices in one, and hence beleive that it does EVERYTHING. However the reason that it's selling poorly in Europe is because of the lack of 3G. So at least in some parts of the world people do know what 3G is. Part of the reason it is selling poorly in Europe is because in some areas without EDGE it's on GPRS, so users are even more aware of the speed issues than in the U.S..
> The real deal average joe iPhone user doesnt even know about these > shortcomings. There are three classes of iPhone users it seems, the [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > only of his hard earned cash on crippled, old, over-hyped technology, > but also of his dignity because he was totally suckered. Then there are the ones that wanted a WiFi web browser, iPod, and quad band phone all in one, and didn't think that $400 was an outrageous price to pay, and that rarely does EDGE web browsing, but that does use it to check e-mail. They may not know what 3G is, but they probably wouldn't pay more each month for it even if they did know.
To me, the most glaring problem with the iPhone is that you can't legally use it while driving in three states (NY, NJ, & CT), and starting July 1, 2008 add CA and WA to the list. Many Asian and European countries also don't allow its use while driving.
rlsusenet@NOSPAMPUHLEEZschnapp.org - 07 Jan 2008 17:44 GMT > To me, the most glaring problem with the iPhone is that you can't > legally use it while driving in three states (NY, NJ, & CT), and > starting July 1, 2008 add CA and WA to the list. Many Asian and European > countries also don't allow its use while driving. Interesting.
I would say that the overpriced and underpowered net connection (as compared to Sprint) was the most glaring problem with the iPhone. I _won_ an iPhone from a local TV station contest this year, and despite my long-time devotion to the Palm platform (I've carried a Palm-based device for 9 years), I would have kept that iPhone if I could have activated it on Sprint under EVDO. Instead, I sold it on eBay.
As for hands-free usage, I'm not sure what you're talking about: The iPhone (like my Treo 700P) has Bluetooth support. Nearly all phones support hands-free usage compatible with the new laws -- via BT handsets and automotive hands-free systems. How is the iPhone any different?
SMS - 08 Jan 2008 17:57 GMT >> To me, the most glaring problem with the iPhone is that you can't >> legally use it while driving in three states (NY, NJ, & CT), and [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > device for 9 years), I would have kept that iPhone if I could have > activated it on Sprint under EVDO. Instead, I sold it on eBay. Certainly anyone that cared about the speed of the web experience would not buy an iPhone, that's true. I think that many buyers either a) don't understand what 3G is, b) didn't care because they were mainly using it as a phone and iPod, c) didn't care because they were going to use it mainly on WiFi, d) figured that it came from Apple it must be g-d's gift to the wireless industry and as religious people they had to buy it, e) didn't realize that they could get high speed data from Verizon or Sprint, f) didn't want to pay for 3G speeds and were happy with the lower price point for 2G,...
> As for hands-free usage, I'm not sure what you're talking about: The > iPhone (like my Treo 700P) has Bluetooth support. Nearly all phones > support hands-free usage compatible with the new laws -- via BT handsets > and automotive hands-free systems. How is the iPhone any different? There is no voice dialing. You can legally answer calls while driving, but you can't legally make calls while driving (in places that require hands free).
Richard B. Gilbert - 07 Jan 2008 18:10 GMT >>> <snip> >>> >>>> There is a fundamental flaw in your premise. >>>> The second that a 3G iPhone hits the market, EVERY EDGE iPhone >>>> immediately depreciates dramatically. <snip>
> To me, the most glaring problem with the iPhone is that you can't > legally use it while driving in three states (NY, NJ, & CT), and > starting July 1, 2008 add CA and WA to the list. Many Asian and European > countries also don't allow its use while driving. At least in New Jersey the law applies to ANY hand held phone!
A lot of people seem to have responded by getting a "Bluetooth" device to hang in their ear! A little silly looking and probably still not a good idea while driving. . . . Not that it's going to stop some people . . . .
SMS - 07 Jan 2008 22:09 GMT >>>> <snip> >>>> [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > At least in New Jersey the law applies to ANY hand held phone! Right, but the iPhone can't be used without holding it to key in the phone number. You can receive calls while driving, but not make them, at least not legally in the states that don't allow holding the handset while driving.
Every other current phone on the market included voice dialing (at least I could not find a single current model other than the iPhone that doesn't have it). Entering a number while driving, having to take your eyes off the road to concentrate on the phone, is very dangerous, and it's great that more states are beginning to ban it.
I think that Apple will eventually come up with a software upgrade for voice dialing, or at least include it on the next revision of the iPhone.
> A lot of people seem to have responded by getting a "Bluetooth" device > to hang in their ear! A little silly looking and probably still not a > good idea while driving. . . . Not that it's going to stop some people It's a little better. While conversing while driving is distracting, the most distracting part of the call is having to dial the number if you aren't voice name dialing or voice digit dialing.
Richard B. Gilbert - 08 Jan 2008 04:34 GMT >>>>> <snip> >>>>> [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > most distracting part of the call is having to dial the number if you > aren't voice name dialing or voice digit dialing. Speach recognition (voice command, voice dialing) is a great idea. Making it work, work reliably, and making it work for everyone, seems to be beyond the capabilties of some cell phone manufacturers! My Motorola RAZR V3m is supposed to accept voice commands and do voice dialing. Maybe it does for some people but it doesn't work for me. I can say "check status" twenty or thirty times before the phone finally recognizes it. In fact, the command "check status", when I say it, frequently results in my phone starting to dial my next door neighbor!!!
YMMV.
clifto - 08 Jan 2008 14:28 GMT > Speach recognition (voice command, voice dialing) is a great idea. > Making it work, work reliably, and making it work for everyone, seems to [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > recognizes it. In fact, the command "check status", when I say it, > frequently results in my phone starting to dial my next door neighbor!!! Try speaking in a higher pitch.
 Signature "I am for socialism, disarmament and ultimately for abolishing the state itself as an instrument of violence and compulsion. I seek social ownership of property, the abolition of the propertied class, and sole control by those who produce wealth. Communism is the goal." -- Roger Baldwin, founder, ACLU
Richard B. Gilbert - 08 Jan 2008 15:33 GMT >>Speach recognition (voice command, voice dialing) is a great idea. >>Making it work, work reliably, and making it work for everyone, seems to [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Try speaking in a higher pitch. My vocal range is one note short of an octave! I don't have a whole lot of choice!
clifto - 08 Jan 2008 23:48 GMT >>>Speach recognition (voice command, voice dialing) is a great idea. >>>Making it work, work reliably, and making it work for everyone, seems to [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > My vocal range is one note short of an octave! I don't have a whole lot > of choice! Mine isn't much greater after radiation treatment (successful) for throat cancer. But often when the phone can't understand me, I can raise pitch enough to make a big difference.
 Signature "I am for socialism, disarmament and ultimately for abolishing the state itself as an instrument of violence and compulsion. I seek social ownership of property, the abolition of the propertied class, and sole control by those who produce wealth. Communism is the goal." -- Roger Baldwin, founder, ACLU
SMS - 08 Jan 2008 14:39 GMT <snip>
> Speach recognition (voice command, voice dialing) is a great idea. > Making it work, work reliably, and making it work for everyone, seems to [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > recognizes it. In fact, the command "check status", when I say it, > frequently results in my phone starting to dial my next door neighbor!!! Yeah, sometimes the voice recognition works perfectly on my V325i, sometimes I get so frustrated with it than when it says "Say a Command" I respond with "you suck." What does work reliably is "digit dial" and "redial." Sometimes when I say "name dial" it redials. Sometimes when it recognizes the name and there are multiple phone numbers and it says "which number?" it doesn't recognize the answer and comes back with "no match found." The older voice-dialing system which required that you train the phone with the name and your voice worked much better than the current Motorola technology.
I think that Apple probably wanted voice-dialing on the iPhone but either a) couldn't find someone to license the firmware to them, b) tried to do it themselves but couldn't get it working in time for the iPhone release, or c) ran into some legal issues with patents on the technology. I can't imagine that they won't have it in the next revision.
clifto - 08 Jan 2008 14:44 GMT > Yeah, sometimes the voice recognition works perfectly on my V325i, > sometimes I get so frustrated with it than when it says "Say a Command" > I respond with "you suck." What does work reliably is "digit dial" and > "redial." Sometimes when I say "name dial" it redials. Try just "name".
> Sometimes when it > recognizes the name and there are multiple phone numbers and it says > "which number?" it doesn't recognize the answer and comes back with "no > match found." I have never gotten that. My V710 is even smart enough to recognize "cell" to mean "mobile".
> The older voice-dialing system which required that you > train the phone with the name and your voice worked much better than the [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > iPhone release, or c) ran into some legal issues with patents on the > technology. I can't imagine that they won't have it in the next revision. Or (d) remembers a certain Dilbert cartoon about handwriting recognition on the Newton that included the words "weave me a cone you cupid bat".
 Signature "I am for socialism, disarmament and ultimately for abolishing the state itself as an instrument of violence and compulsion. I seek social ownership of property, the abolition of the propertied class, and sole control by those who produce wealth. Communism is the goal." -- Roger Baldwin, founder, ACLU
SMS - 08 Jan 2008 16:51 GMT >> Yeah, sometimes the voice recognition works perfectly on my V325i, >> sometimes I get so frustrated with it than when it says "Say a Command" >> I respond with "you suck." What does work reliably is "digit dial" and >> "redial." Sometimes when I say "name dial" it redials. > > Try just "name". Yes, that's a good idea. That won't confuse it between name dial and redial. I tried it and it works.
>> Sometimes when it >> recognizes the name and there are multiple phone numbers and it says >> "which number?" it doesn't recognize the answer and comes back with "no >> match found." > > I have never gotten that. My V710 is even smart enough to recognize "cell"
> to mean "mobile". That didn't work on the V325i.
Yeah, though current handwriting recognition, such as what Microsoft has in XP Tablet Edition, is excellent.
Steve
John Navas - 08 Jan 2008 20:42 GMT >"U.S. District Judge James Selna issued the ruling Monday, the latest in >a series of legal victories Broadcom scored over Qualcomm last year [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] >the whole RIM mess last year, but they settled eventually, as everyone >predicted. In fact the settlement was far outside of normal settlement territory, and not what "everyone predicted".
>This whole patent dispute is one reason that W-CDMA didn't make it into >the iPhone. That last is even more patent nonsense. W-CDMA chips are readily available from other sources. The primary real reasons is almost certainly power consumption of the available chips.
 Signature Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS: John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>
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