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Cellular Phone Forum / Providers / ATT Wireless / May 2008

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NEWS: Apple Online store lists iPhone as

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Ron - 12 May 2008 14:10 GMT
CURRENTLY UNAVAILABLE:

3G iPhone may be out sooner than previously suggested ???

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=482642
4phun - 12 May 2008 22:24 GMT
>   CURRENTLY UNAVAILABLE:
>
> 3G iPhone may be out sooner than previously suggested ???
>
> http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=482642

What is interesting is that no one  has the orginal Apple iPhone 8K or
16K for sale anywhere.

What happened to them all? Are all the parts used to make them now
going into the new model?
Charles - 13 May 2008 01:07 GMT
In article
<f8c64ca9-b121-41ca-a547-95fc9d494f9f@d77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>,

> What is interesting is that no one  has the orginal Apple iPhone 8K or
> 16K for sale anywhere.

You can still get them from AT&T.

Signature

Charles

Todd Allcock - 13 May 2008 01:12 GMT
> What is interesting is that no one  has the orginal Apple iPhone 8K or
> 16K for sale anywhere.

8 or 16 _K_?  Were these very early models based on the Apple II rather than
OS X?   ;-)
Larry - 13 May 2008 02:15 GMT
> 8 or 16 _K_?  Were these very early models based on the Apple II
> rather than OS X?   ;-)

Now, now....be nice.
SMS - 13 May 2008 15:09 GMT
>> What is interesting is that no one  has the orginal Apple iPhone 8K or
>> 16K for sale anywhere.
>
> 8 or 16 _K_?  Were these very early models based on the Apple II rather
> than OS X?   ;-)

They used the Apple II OS, with one of the Apple II CP/M cards.
Larry - 13 May 2008 15:42 GMT
SMS <scharf.steven@geemail.com> wrote in news:EehWj.499$BL6.318
@nlpi070.nbdc.sbc.com:

> CP/M

Question for the kids:

What does PIP mean?
Dennis Ferguson - 13 May 2008 17:18 GMT
> SMS <scharf.steven@geemail.com> wrote in news:EehWj.499$BL6.318
> @nlpi070.nbdc.sbc.com:
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
> What does PIP mean?

If it means "Peripheral Interchange Program" then they copied the
name directly from one of several rather unpleasant DEC operating
systems.

I was never happier than when we began installing Unix on the PDP-11's.

Dennis Ferguson
Larry - 13 May 2008 22:43 GMT
> PDP-11's

I worked for Tracor Applied Sciences, Electronic Systems Division on Navy
contracts for a time before joining Charleston Naval Shipyard and civil
service.  One task we performed was to install an extensive
fire/flood/intruder alarm system into Tracor Marine's SEACON Sea
Construction Barge which was a neat little ship who's central structure
was a huge garage with the deck that opened up as well as its roof so you
could lower heavy objects picked up from the deck on the stern down
through the middle (center of moment) of the ship without tilting it.

Central to its mission was a sonobouy detection system that consisted of
4 sonar ping sensors.  A sonobouy was fired at the bottom over the spot
you wanted to put the barge.  Then, a PDP-8 minicomputer monitored the
sonar's phase relationship of the 4 ping, actually more of a click,
detectors.  The PDP-8 controlled 3 of the craziest propulsion plants I
ever saw.  A diesel engine drove a hydraulic pump and the computer
controlled valves that set a vertical "egg beater" contraption spinning
around a vertical axis.  The blades were controlled, hydraulically, and
could push the barge in ANY direction maintaining the barge without
anchoring lines that would get in the way of underwater construction
centered right over that little sonobouy clicking away on the bottom.

This contraption, however, could only make about 6 knots wide open, so it
was towed with an ocean tug on a LONG line to wherever the job was, like
Diego Garcia where it built a huge chain-fall anchorage in the center of
Diego Garcia's underwater volcano cone to tie ships out to.  I was nearly
Shanghai'd for that trip because of my electronic knowledge and a couple
of favors I did for her captain.  (The welders wanted me, too, because I
had watched them trying to hydraulic hand start a 6-cyl Navy welding
monster all day, on and off as I worked my job.  In the afternoon, still
not running, I walked down the pier and asked all these "mechanics" if
they had primed this brand new diesel engine...drawing blank stares like
I was from Mars.  After a short explanation to the assembled "experts", a
tool box appeared and I cracked open the EMPTY fuel filter and filled it,
opened the nuts on all the injectors after filling the injection pump and
turned her over twice to prime the lines and get the air out.  One last
long hand pump on the hydraulic starting manual pressure pump, close all
the open nuts and lines, open the throttle a little and STOMP on the
start valve button....VAaaaRRROOOOMM!!!, one welding machine up and
running!  One standing ovation from the poor sweating bastards that had
been pumping on it all day to no avail.  They just put lube oil into it
and expected it to crank itself....hee hee.)

We took SEACON out for a little pleasure cruise around Little Creek
Amphib Base and the river cruise to play with her joy stick and computer.  
What a cool way to run a boat!

Crank engine, let 'er warm up a minute.....
Move joystick to port away from pier...boat moves sideways away from
pier.
Release joystick at point where you want to stop sideways motion.  Boat
stops DEAD STILL, even though all diesel engines still running fast.
Move joystick towards bow slowly and boat moves towards bow in proportion
to how far you push little joystick!  This is GREAT!
Out in open harbor, recenter joystick and boat stops dead.
ROTATE joystick clockwise looking down on it.....BOAT TURNS CLOCKWISE ON
ITS AXIS as if boat is made like a washtub!
Recenter joystick, boat rotation stops dead still.

This is more fun to drive than anything I ever drove.....and SO EASY!

If you rotate the stick while pressing toward the NORTH, and move the
stick around so it continues to be pointed to the North, even though the
boat is rotating around under it.....THE DAMNED THING WILL SPIN UNDERWAY
GOING NORTH!  It only goes slowly, but it works!

There's never been a bow thruster to match this crazy propulsion
system....(c;

The food and coffee aboard SEACON was the worst I ever had....it was just
AWFUL!  Even the BUGJUICE was AWFUL!
Ron - 13 May 2008 16:10 GMT
>>> What is interesting is that no one  has the orginal Apple iPhone 8K or
>>> 16K for sale anywhere.
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>
>They used the Apple II OS, with one of the Apple II CP/M cards.

Don;t forget the 80 column card.
Todd Allcock - 13 May 2008 01:13 GMT
> What is interesting is that no one  has the orginal Apple iPhone 8K or
> 16K for sale anywhere.

8 or 16 _K_?  Were these very early models based on the Apple II rather than
OS X?   ;-)
Ron - 13 May 2008 03:04 GMT
>> What is interesting is that no one  has the orginal Apple iPhone 8K or
>> 16K for sale anywhere.
>
>8 or 16 _K_?  Were these very early models based on the Apple II rather than
>OS X?   ;-)

I remember paying $200 for 16K of Ram back in 1980, and paying $300
for 1 Meg of Ram in 1987.
Larry - 13 May 2008 05:26 GMT
> I remember paying $200 for 16K of Ram back in 1980, and paying $300
> for 1 Meg of Ram in 1987.

Which computer, Ron?  I had the Southwest Tech Products and built several
S-100 bus beasts.  These kids would be horrified.

.....Then some smartass came out with the $250 25ma teletype interface!  
I still have paper tape machine language programs in a drawer around here
somewhere....(c;

As long as we're in "confession mode"....I once paid $2,295 for a 33MB,
full height, Tulin 4-platter hard drive for my IBM-PC XT from Crazy Bob's
Computer Warehouse in Atlanta.....$200 off!

It was the largest PC drive on the market and I just HAD to have one!

The drive is gone, but I still have the receipt....(c;

I paid $2,495 for the Compaq Portable PC with its twin 720KB floppy
drives, 64KB of RAM and 9" GREEN screen from Sears Computer Center in
Jacksonville, FL.  The keyboard fit right into the bottom of the sewing
machine case!  It only weighed as much as a Singer, too!

I'd be afraid to add up what I've wasted on computer hardware and
software since 1980.....too scary to even contemplate....I made Silicon
Valley's house payments many times....

But, alas, it's been one helluva great ride!

Clipper was the Dbase III COMPILER for the PCXT that made Dbase III haul
a.s.  My license number was 2400 out of the millions of copies sold...(c;

I was also an Ohio Scientific computer dealer, the FIRST microcomputer
with a real 74MB, 14" platter fixed hard drive in commercial production.  
OS-65u with extended BASIC on its 6502 processor.....or you could run
CP/M on its Z-80.....or whatever the hell you wanted on its Motorola
6800....(c;
...all in a 19" rack about 18" high with dumb serial terminals we bought
from a local manufacturer in Columbia, SC, 30 miles from home.

We wrote custom BASIC software for the vending machine industry to track
machine production, inventory products and track the truck productions.  
Quite something for those days....

Remember the first time you pressed RUN, the lights went crazy with
output, then you had to step through the "results" and read the 8 light
bulbs to find out what it did?....(c;

.....and couldn't sleep for days because it didn't did what you wanted it
to did?!

......................................Linux is easy....................
Ron - 13 May 2008 12:46 GMT
>> I remember paying $200 for 16K of Ram back in 1980, and paying $300
>> for 1 Meg of Ram in 1987.
[quoted text clipped - 43 lines]
>output, then you had to step through the "results" and read the 8 light
>bulbs to find out what it did?....(c;

I dont go back THAT far.

>.....and couldn't sleep for days because it didn't did what you wanted it
>to did?!

I did have 2 boxes of punch cards to do statistical analysis in 1970,
and wrote a program in Fortran to do text plots of statistical
log probabilities. I never lost sleep, my programs worked.

Published in 1973 in the Journal of Sedimentary Petrology.

>......................................Linux is easy....................

My picture was in a National Magazine as the leading edge of the home
computer revolution, as in 1983; we had 2 computers in our home;
one for the kiddos, and one for the parents.

But the children couldnt touch the computer till all their homework
was done, and couldn't play games on computer, till they had done 30
minutes of math drills I had programmed in Basic.

Must of worked, they both graduated college Phi Beta Kappa
with 3.9+ GPAs; after having full academic scholarships.
Elmo P. Shagnasty - 13 May 2008 13:40 GMT
> My picture was in a National Magazine as the leading edge of the home
> computer revolution, as in 1983; we had 2 computers in our home;
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>
> Must of worked,

"Must of"?

Yeah, brilliant.  "Must have," Einstein.  "Must have."
Larry - 13 May 2008 15:41 GMT
> My picture was in a National Magazine as the leading edge of the home
> computer revolution, as in 1983; we had 2 computers in our home;
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> Must of worked, they both graduated college Phi Beta Kappa
> with 3.9+ GPAs; after having full academic scholarships.

Congratulations on all points!  Today's kids would be a lot better off if
you handed them broken computer hardware or crashed software and told
them they couldn't do their homework until they had fixed it.  At least
they would have demonstrable skills, unlike high school graduates.

I have an English friend who lives in Atlanta.  Many years ago he found a
pasteboard box with a little black baby girl some crackheads had
abandoned in one of Atlanta's biggest malls.  A really good person, he
followed her into the terrible socialist services debacle and ended up
adopting her, the best thing that ever happened in her short life.  A few
years ago, she graduated near the top of her class in Nursing and is now
a well-paid RN in a major hospital.  My English friends are very well off
in commercial construction and real estate making all this possible.  She
looks almost a match for Brandi, the beautiful singer.

Whenever someone asks about his black daughter, he paints a terrible
picture of him and a teenage prostitute.  You have to know him to
appreciate the dry English humor in all of it....(c;

NOONE is more fun, drunk at a party....NOONE.
Ron - 13 May 2008 16:11 GMT
>> My picture was in a National Magazine as the leading edge of the home
>> computer revolution, as in 1983; we had 2 computers in our home;
[quoted text clipped - 27 lines]
>
>NOONE is more fun, drunk at a party....NOONE.

Not even George W. Bush ?
Larry - 13 May 2008 02:13 GMT
4phun <vic.healey@gmail.com> wrote in news:f8c64ca9-b121-41ca-a547-
95fc9d494f9f@d77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com:

> What is interesting is that no one  has the orginal Apple iPhone 8K or
> 16K for sale anywhere.
>
> What happened to them all? Are all the parts used to make them now
> going into the new model?

Doesn't Apple recall dealer stocks instead of dumping and discounting on
all its product lines?  Do the dealers dump the last model Macs to get rid
of them as the new model comes out, or do they scrap them so they can
demand full retail for the new models?

I don't recall ever seeing a big "Apple Sale" dumping old products....other
than used from the screwed customers.
Ron - 13 May 2008 03:06 GMT
>4phun <vic.healey@gmail.com> wrote in news:f8c64ca9-b121-41ca-a547-
>95fc9d494f9f@d77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com:
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
>I don't recall ever seeing a big "Apple Sale" dumping old products....other
>than used from the screwed customers.

Discontinued models typically sold for 15% off, with Apple reimbursing
authorized dealers if memory serves correctly.
Larry - 13 May 2008 05:07 GMT
> Discontinued models typically sold for 15% off, with Apple reimbursing
> authorized dealers if memory serves correctly.

With a new 3G broadband iPhone up against the 2G model dragging along like
a snail, 15% would be simply stupid.  I see why they're hiding them...(c;
Ron - 13 May 2008 12:49 GMT
>> Discontinued models typically sold for 15% off, with Apple reimbursing
>> authorized dealers if memory serves correctly.
>
>With a new 3G broadband iPhone up against the 2G model dragging along like
>a snail, 15% would be simply stupid.  I see why they're hiding them...(c;

I fully expect ATT to charge $40/month for the 3g data plan for a 3g
iPhone, which would leave some attraction for the original iPhone with
its $20 data plan.

And unless you're watching a Verizon commercial, WiFi is enough most
of the time for most folks.
Larry - 13 May 2008 15:23 GMT
> And unless you're watching a Verizon commercial, WiFi is enough most
> of the time for most folks.

If you're saddled with 2G, Wifi is enough ALL of the time.....
Kevin Weaver - 13 May 2008 18:09 GMT
>>> Discontinued models typically sold for 15% off, with Apple reimbursing
>>> authorized dealers if memory serves correctly.
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
> And unless you're watching a Verizon commercial, WiFi is enough most
> of the time for most folks.

Friend has a iPhone which on edge is great on battery life. Switch to wi-fi
and the battery is cut to half. He wants to get the new 3G model when they
come out.

He used about 35% of his fully charged battery in 30 mins on wi-fi. If 3G is
in the same ballpark as wi-fi in battery use, expect about 90mins before it
going dead.

When he tested the battery life, all settings were the same as the edge
testing. Without a battery door, I will never get one. We know why that
won't install a battery door. And it's not because of the size the iPhone
would be after.
Tinman - 13 May 2008 18:50 GMT
> Friend has a iPhone which on edge is great on battery life. Switch to
> wi-fi and the battery is cut to half. He wants to get the new 3G
> model when they come out.

Something is wrong with either your friend, or your friend's iPhone.

Edge drains the battery more than WiFi. Not debatable.

> He used about 35% of his fully charged battery in 30 mins on wi-fi.
> If 3G is in the same ballpark as wi-fi in battery use, expect about
> 90mins before it going dead.

Any conclusions based on an iPhone that uses 35% of its battery after 30
minutes on WiFi are questionable, to say the least.

Signature

Mike

Kevin Weaver - 13 May 2008 18:53 GMT
>> Friend has a iPhone which on edge is great on battery life. Switch to
>> wi-fi and the battery is cut to half. He wants to get the new 3G
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> Any conclusions based on an iPhone that uses 35% of its battery after 30
> minutes on WiFi are questionable, to say the least.

I know what I saw. Yep you got that right. POS Iphone. I warned him. :)
Todd Allcock - 13 May 2008 20:08 GMT
>> Friend has a iPhone which on edge is great on battery life. Switch to
>> wi-fi and the battery is cut to half. He wants to get the new 3G
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>
> Edge drains the battery more than WiFi. Not debatable.

Really?  Is the WiFi in the iPhone geometrically better than the WiFi in
other phones?  I can surf on EDGE onn my HTC Wizard practically
indefinately, while WiFi drains the battery noticeably.  I'd estimate I
could use WiFi for 2-3 hours max (constant surfing- not just "on") while an
hour of internet use with EDGE hardly bumps the battery meter.

>> He used about 35% of his fully charged battery in 30 mins on wi-fi.
>> If 3G is in the same ballpark as wi-fi in battery use, expect about
>> 90mins before it going dead.
>
> Any conclusions based on an iPhone that uses 35% of its battery after 30
> minutes on WiFi are questionable, to say the least.
Larry - 13 May 2008 22:55 GMT
"Todd Allcock" <elecconnec@AmericaOnLine.com> wrote in news:zGlWj.3$2g1.1
@fe119.usenetserver.com:

> Really?  Is the WiFi in the iPhone geometrically better than the WiFi in
> other phones?  

Here's the little-known, ugly truth behind the new 3G iPhone:
http://www.batteryspace.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=3186

Runs nearly 10 hours, though, without recharging!
Tinman - 16 May 2008 14:04 GMT
> "Tinman" <ask@for.it> wrote in message
>>
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> Really?  Is the WiFi in the iPhone geometrically better than the WiFi
> in other phones?

I don't care much what other phones do "geometrically," but there is no
question the iPhone gets better battery life on WiFi Vs. Edge. This is not
to say that its Edge battery-life is poor; only that WiFi is better. All
else being equal, naturally.

Signature

Mike

Larry - 13 May 2008 22:47 GMT
> Any conclusions based on an iPhone that uses 35% of its battery after 30
> minutes on WiFi are questionable, to say the least.

He musta had a Jailbroken iPhone with an actual PROGRAM RUNNING, which
would kill its tiny battery.

But, IT'S SO THIN, RIGHT?!
Larry - 13 May 2008 22:45 GMT
"Kevin Weaver" <kevinkeithweaver@sbcglobal.net> wrote in news:9XjWj.3434
$nW2.2685@nlpi064.nbdc.sbc.com:

> Friend has a iPhone which on edge is great on battery life.

I hope you meant on EDGE, not on edge.  If it was on edge, maybe it was
related to the accelerometers...(c;
 
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