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Cellular Phone Forum / Providers / ATT Wireless / July 2008FruitFoners can't read....GIF at 11
There were 56 waiting in line, some since 9PM last night, vying for the 60 FruitFones ATT had at the North Charleston main store when it opened at 8 this morning. I counted them as I arrived to photograph them. Most I interviewed were there to get a FruitFone with a GPS in it, about 70%. This is why the header to this post is they can't read. "Assisted GPS" ISN'T a GPS installed inside the phone, from looking at the high resolution hardware pictures posted to ifixit.com's website last night. GPS receivers have a receiver, processor chipset and antenna...missing on 3G FruitFone's PC board. Some said thanks. Others got mad that I had the audacity to question "God's will", vis-a-vis Apple. Others were shocked when I told them former FruitFoners were trying to trade their FruitFones and $50 for a place in line posted to the net last night. A young black girl in her Air Force uniform thought that was a great idea and had 5 old FruitFones in perfect condition offered to her, even though she was at the back of the line. She got the one with the nicest leather case and its owner will give her the rest of it after she gets off work this afternoon. She then left him her space in line, to the dismay of the ones behind her. She got there at 0530 this morning and got her FruitFone at 0720 for $75, without activation. Well, I gotta go to work. It was interesting to talk to real FruitFoners in line this morning. I told the boys at Waffle House they shoulda had a truck loaded with breakfast and coffee at the line this morning. Some of those folks looked awful hungry after a night in the parking lot. Your reporter in Charleston, SC, for alt.cellular.attws.... Well Larry for a cell phone without a GPS it does just about as well as a MIO, TomTom or Garmin in tracking your location in real time. Why is that Larry? You said it doesn't have a GPS chip. Apple says it does BTW. If you are right Larry then Apple has pulled off a big advance of providing accurate GPS locations without any need for a dedicated chip, all others are now doomed. What is a little weird is I took the thing into the toilet deep in the interior of my house and turned the maps function on again, within a few seconds it accurately showed the distance from my car out by the mailbox where I had dropped a pin and my new position. How did that sucker figure it out when I had no view of the sky except through an open door to a hallway and a distant view of a window? I got the little blue glowing orb which is an indicator of the GPS and its accuracy for any given second. Now I noticed that it sometimes lags a few feet behind the google map while driving at high speed but below 45 MPH it seems dead on and when you slow for a turn it is always dead on. I like turning on the hybrid view and zooming way in to see the detailed close up satellite view as I drive. That is more fun then my stand alone GPS units! Someone is going to wreck or get killed with one of these phones in the next few days as this is to much fun tp pay close attention to other traffic. > There were 56 waiting in line, some since 9PM last night, vying for the 60 > FruitFones ATT had at the North Charleston main store when it opened at 8 [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > > Your reporter in Charleston, SC, for alt.cellular.attws.... > Well Larry for a cell phone without a GPS it does just about as well > as a MIO, TomTom or Garmin in tracking your location in real time. Really? I wasn't aware that MIO, Tom Tom or Garmin units "lag a few feet behind the map while driving at high speed... " Todd Allcock <elecconnec@AmericaOnLine.com> wrote in news:g58ik6$adb$3 @aioe.org: > Really? I wasn't aware that MIO, Tom Tom or Garmin units "lag a few feet > behind the map while driving at high speed... " Actually they all do GPS only updates ONCE each second, putting the fix you see at high speed a ways behind your actual position. The delay is caused by the intense calculating of phase differences against timing differences between the up to 12-20 birds over your horizon the GPS chipset is locked onto. The position presented is the position you WERE at when the calculation started....many milliseconds ago. Jet fighters have inertial guidance that corrects this delay in software when it compares the GPS signal position calculated with the inertial guidance solution from the computer and terrain mapping mere mortals like us are not privy to...(c; The lag is proportional to speed, so when you stop at a light, after only one second, your position is as accurate as your GPS is capable of calculating, about 3 ft with WAAS compensation. Notice how, as you're cruising along the interstate, the fix jumps at one second intervals....That's GPS... The $10,000 superyacht GPS performs exactly the same way....(c; > Really? I wasn't aware that MIO, Tom Tom or Garmin units "lag a few feet > behind the map while driving at high speed... " Speaking of TomTom, it does something kind of annoying at times: if the GPS puts you at a position that it thinks unlikely, it will display you as being somewhere it thinks more sensible. I took my TomTom on a cross country train trip, and if there was a road parallel to tracks within about 50 yards of the tracks, it would often put me in the middle of that road, rather than on the train tracks. When the road diverged sufficiently from the tracks, it would then jump my position to the tracks. There doesn't seem to be any way to tell it that you want it to show the GPS position, even if there isn't a road on the map at that position.  Signature--Tim Smith >Speaking of TomTom, it does something kind of annoying at times: if the >GPS puts you at a position that it thinks unlikely, it will display you [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >There doesn't seem to be any way to tell it that you want it to show the >GPS position, even if there isn't a road on the map at that position. Not sure on the TomTom, but look for an option that says like "Off Road"? Some of the Older GPS's I've had had this - this would basically be like telling it that if you go off road, that's fine - don't try to put the icon on the road no matter what. SignatureTo reply via e-mail, remove The Obvious from my e-mail address. Tim Smith <reply_in_group@mouse-potato.com> wrote in news:reply_in_group- 17D04E.04271012072008@news.supernews.com: > I took my TomTom on a cross country train trip, and if there was a road > parallel to tracks within about 50 yards of the tracks, it would often > put me in the middle of that road, rather than on the train tracks. > When the road diverged sufficiently from the tracks, it would then jump > my position to the tracks. That would be very annoying. It's a sign they're trying to cover up for a lack of accuracy. > Tim Smith <reply_in_group@mouse-potato.com> wrote in news:reply_in_group- > 17D04E.04271012072008@news.supernews.com: [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > That would be very annoying. It's a sign they're trying to cover up for a > lack of accuracy. TomTom is a device specifically geared to the automotive navigation market. It's not a sign that they're trying to cover *anything* up, it's just a sign that the programmers made a stupid assumption that anyone using the device would be in a car on a road. Boy, Larry, you're one paranoid bastard. 4phun <vic.healey@gmail.com> wrote in news:4099de52-4da8-4155-80a1- fee50ec7b527@k30g2000hse.googlegroups.com: > Why is that Larry? You said it doesn't have a GPS chip. Apple says it > does BTW. I'm asking anyone to point out, on the high resolution picture of the 3G FruitFone board, the GPS receiver and its associated GPS processor chips..... We cannot find them. GPS uses specific chipsets, there are several manufacturers. GPS is NOT A PIECE OF MAC APP CODE. List the GPS chipset parts on that board and I'll just stop....It's very simple.... Here is a picture of the best one made: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/7/7e/M10214_20071003_3764.jpg The planar panels on each end are the phased array antenna system. This is a complete, 20-channel, WAAS-compensated GPS receiver and it's the coolest one made. It drains the battery something just AWFUL at 62 mw of power and it has a simply incredible -159 dbm receiver sensitivity to pick up the very faint signals from the birds 16,800 miles away in polar orbits...up to 20 at a time! -159 dbm is a power level of .000000000000000125 milliwatts! On the sunny side of the planet, sun-created noise radiating off a parking lot is about 1000 times this level in broadband noise at the GPS UHF frequency band. It is simply an amazing piece of engineering. http://live.ifixit.com/images/QuqS4aNEDOoQrOod-large.jpg Here's the antenna PC board the gold plated spring contact on the main board touches for a sellphone antenna....on the bottom, the worst place under your hand....idiots. http://live.ifixit.com/images/m2VNZsbxyPGHpkSC-large.jpg Hmm....I just found something new on the OTHER side of this board....a coaxial connector with pads going to it on the BATTERY side. Look at this picture. I may have to eat crow...not the first time.....(c; In the upper part of this picture, you see a round female gold-plated connector that is tapered so that it mates with "something". Under it there are PC traces coming out in parallel (these may be "stripline" impedance matching sections if there is an internal ground plane inside the board, in the middle. Striplines are very old technology but the best we ever had. These two black lines come over to what LOOKS like a white parts number sticker of some sort. I tried to find that number and it traces to nothing....not a GPS receiver Google ever heard about...or even an IC number anywhere on the net. There's a little row of tiny surface mount parts above this white "sticker", which MAY be an IC under it...surface mount. The black lines from the round cone coax connector, which may be a connector for your GPS receiver go under the big shield cover on the left....where there may be more circuits not yet pictured on the net. This could very well be the connection for a planar GPS antenna in the new plastic back...which would make it have a bulge in it like the Nokia N810 has. The N810 uses the fantastic chipset at the top of this message, same as my external BT GPS receiver and all other Nokia GPS products...including their phones. Now, using this picture: http://live.ifixit.com/images/2a.jpg notice, using the gold-plated antenna contact in the last picture, the last picture is looking at the BACK of the board in this picture. I wonder why ifixit didn't complete the disassembly they started and remove teh shield cover from the BACK of the main board so we could look at what is mounted on the back?! I assumed they knew what they were doing, being hardware geeks, but, now I'm not sure they found but HALF the new FruitFone's circuit chipsets! There has got to be other chips mounted on the OTHER side of the board from the 2a picture here..... Until we can see that side of the board with the brown shield cover removed, we can't really tell what's on that side.... I'll bite....I think I just found the GPS antenna input for a GPS chipset UNDER that shield cover on the back of the FruitFone....added on as an afterthought, probably. I was running on the assumption the chips on ifixit were the ONLY chips on the board....I doubt they know this isn't all of them......well, yet...(c; > > Why is that Larry? You said it doesn't have a GPS chip. Apple says it > > does BTW. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > We cannot find them. GPS uses specific chipsets, there are several > manufacturers. GPS is NOT A PIECE OF MAC APP CODE. that's probably because Apple designed many of the specific iphone chips... they have a long history of building their own IC's, so for something as simple as GPS, they would have simply engineered it in themselves. > List the GPS chipset parts on that board and I'll just stop....It's very > simple.... > > Here is a picture of the best one made: > http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/7/7e/M10214_20071003_3764.jpg oh, my god... look at the traces on that! something from the 1990's or worse... i'm simply laughing too hard respond to the rest... good god, larry... you are waaaay out of the loop when it comes to modern cell phone electronics. > 4phun <vic.healey@gmail.com> wrote in news:4099de52-4da8-4155-80a1- > fee50ec7b527@k30g2000hse.googlegroups.com: [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > FruitFone board, the GPS receiver and its associated GPS processor > chips..... You really show your lack of intelligence by asking someone to identify an internal chipset by looking at the case. That's like asking someone to identify the engine by a picture of a car. I supplied supercomputers to many of the eight fab factories in the late '80s. Your mindset is trapped in the 1960s. Your penchant for 'fruit' and 'waffle house' tells us more about you that you can ever say. "Those of you that think you know everything, irritate those of us that do". On 7/12/08 9:30 AM, in article De3ek.9$ND7.5@newsfe07.lga, "Thurman" <thurman@bigplanet.com> wrote: >> 4phun <vic.healey@gmail.com> wrote in news:4099de52-4da8-4155-80a1- >> fee50ec7b527@k30g2000hse.googlegroups.com: [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > Your penchant for 'fruit' and 'waffle house' tells us more about you that > you can ever say. "Second childhood", some would call. > You really show your lack of intelligence by asking someone to > identify an internal chipset by looking at the case. That's like > asking someone to identify the engine by a picture of a car. I > supplied supercomputers to many of the eight fab factories in the late > '80s. Your mindset is trapped in the 1960s. I had the chipset wrong. The chip I identified incorporates the Marvell 400mw wifi transceiver and CSR Bluetooth transceiver, as noted on: http://live.ifixit.com/images/6pp5MISgVfdarIV1-large.jpg ...after the picture was annotated by other people, like myself, who lack intellegence because we want to identify every internal chipset by looking at the BOARD, not the case. Other people, showing their lack of intelligence by asking someone to identify an internal chipset, have identified the unit's GPS on picture: http://live.ifixit.com/images/XiuvbfUecK3GsDUm-large.jpg as the Infineon PMB2525 "Hammerhead II" GPS-on-a-chip. ------------------------------------------------------------- I'd like to set the record straight, with all the fanbois, on another matter...... Look closely at: http://live.ifixit.com/images/XiuvbfUecK3GsDUm-large.jpg and the list of manufacturers identified by this picture. I keep hearing fanbois telling us how wonderful this gadget is because Apple made it. I hope they'll have the decency to note that Apple did NOT make the iPhone. Apple integrated technologies from a host of OTHER companies, just like every other computer gadget company on the planet, into a single unit they put their name on. NONE of the ICs identified, so far, which is most all of them except a few support chips, was made by Apple, Inc. Iphone is made of off-the-shelf parts and is not something unique made especially for you in some Apple laboratory like a fine watch. It's just another device....just like my devices....and hardly worth camping out overnight to buy. How silly it all is.... It's main processor is from Samsung, whos own new sellphones you fanbois poopoo as old technology, when the latest iPhone's ARM processor is the same one....only the software is different, making it do other things. > I keep hearing fanbois telling us how wonderful this gadget is because > Apple made it. I hope they'll have the decency to note that Apple did > NOT make the iPhone. no? who did? dell? motorola? nokia? c'mon, who made it? > Apple integrated technologies from a host of OTHER > companies, just like every other computer gadget company on the planet, > into a single unit they put their name on. so apple is just like every other company, but somehow they're bad and the others aren't? why aren't you slamming dell? > NONE of the ICs identified, > so far, which is most all of them except a few support chips, was made > by Apple, Inc. so even though there *are* apple designed parts, it's not made by apple. i see. > Apple integrated technologies from a host of OTHER > companies, just like every other computer gadget company on the planet, > into a single unit they put their name on. Not quite accurate. Apple hired a company in India to do that work. Apple hasn't done much hardware engineering themselves in many long years (not many fanboys know that the Newton was just a rebranded Sharp Wizard). In the not too distant future, the Indians will come out with cheaper and better products under their own name, much as the Japanese, Koreans, Chinese, etc. have done before them. Maybe they'll buy the Apple name to use as a brand, the way LG owns the Zenith name. -- Mark -- http://panda.com/mrc Democracy is two wolves and a sheep deciding what to eat for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed sheep contesting the vote. > Apple hired a company in India to do that work. Apple hasn't done much > hardware engineering themselves in many long years (not many fanboys know > that the Newton was just a rebranded Sharp Wizard). nonsense. apple has done and continues to do a lot of hardware engineering themselves. and although apple and sharp worked together, the newton was not simply a rebranded sharp wizard. just where do people come up with this crap? > In the not too distant future, the Indians will come out with cheaper and > better products under their own name, much as the Japanese, Koreans, > Chinese, etc. have done before them. Maybe they'll buy the Apple name to > use as a brand, the way LG owns the Zenith name. not likely. > You really show your lack of intelligence by asking someone to > identify an internal chipset by looking at the case. That's like > asking someone to identify the engine by a picture of a car. I > supplied supercomputers to many of the eight fab factories in the late > '80s. Your mindset is trapped in the 1960s. Here's an article from Jan 2007 on the 3G's tiny GPS receiver: http://www.gpslodge.com/archives/009147.php According to this article: http://wirelessanalyst.blogspot.com/2008/06/infineon-wireless-business.html Hammerhead II was developed to give GSM phones the required E911 GPS function. You'll probably find it in GSM phones since 2007. "Infineon’s strategy seems to be to provide low-cost cellular platforms whose gaps can be filled by other vendors. The 2G iPhone platform is a good example. While its cellular ICs were from Infineon, the application processor was from Samsung, WLAN from Marvell and Bluetooth from CSR. This model will work fine as long as handset vendors are interested in picking the best-in-class components based on cost and performance. If, on the other hand, the trend drifts towards highly integrated single vendor solutions, the handicaps in Infineon’s mobile portfolio will result in the company losing its market share, potentially including iPhone designs 2009 and beyond. Infineon will not be in a position to compete with the likes of Qualcomm, Broadcom and STM, all of whom have a complete portfolio to build single-stop cellular platforms. " >> You really show your lack of intelligence by asking someone to >> identify an internal chipset by looking at the case. That's like [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > Hammerhead II was developed to give GSM phones the required E911 GPS > function. You'll probably find it in GSM phones since 2007. Funny that you'd be posting this Larry. Particularly funny given that you were the one heralding only a couple days ago that the 3G iPhone had NO GPS chip in it. In all caps, as I remember. Ironic that the information on this chipset has been floating around on the web for a year and a half when you originally claimed it didn't exist. And now you're taking credit for sharing this wonderful info with us, when most of us could care less what the hell you have to say. You rally about the "fanbois", but you seem to be one yourself--only you're a fan not of Apple but of yourself. 4phun <vic.healey@gmail.com> wrote in news:4099de52-4da8-4155-80a1- fee50ec7b527@k30g2000hse.googlegroups.com: > Why is that Larry? You said it doesn't have a GPS chip. Apple says it > does BTW. THE CLOT THICKENS! They DID pull the bottom shield off it and I didn't see any components on it so just went by it late last night.... Go here! http://live.ifixit.com/images/3jYKHyIVrAHnG4Br-large.jpg This is the BOTTOM of the board...see our white label on the lower right corner with the gold contact? Now, go to the UPPER LEFT corner of the board...opposite our white label! There's yet ANOTHER coaxial connector! THIS one is hooked to two small little white components, directly! The 6-pin flatpack I'm guessing to be the front end RF amp and mixer of the GPS receiver. The bigger chip next to it, would be the first IF amplifier as it has two traces to the 6-pin flatpack's output. The bigger white chip then feeds the oddball, not-listed-anywhere-by-anyone LBEE1WRLFC-255 IC that there is no listing for on Google, either. OK, this is most probably its GPS receiver I passed over because of all the hoopla over the OTHER side the data geeks are analyzing. I apologize for the error, I've found its oddball, unknown GPS receiver chipset noone has ever heard about....but someone, somewhere in China has produced....?? go figure. The big grey chip feeds the processor through the traces and through-board traces below it....who knows what data...?? This side of the board with two RF connectors on it, must point towards the new plastic bubble that has replaced the RF-unfriendly aluminum back on v 1.0. Buried in that plastic must be the panel antennas....under your hand pointing towards the ground as you hold it.....??? Stupid! REALLY STUPID! The antenna's pointing AWAY from the birds! You guys with FruitFones, when you find an area where the GPS starts moving you queerly around on the map, try holding the phone above your heads (outdoors, not inside the metal car roof of course, with the display pointing DOWN towards you and the ground! I bet the GPS signal goes way up and the queer movement stops.... 4phun <vic.healey@gmail.com> wrote in news:4099de52-4da8-4155-80a1- fee50ec7b527@k30g2000hse.googlegroups.com: > Why is that Larry? You said it doesn't have a GPS chip. Apple says it > does BTW. Look at teh plastic back: http://live.ifixit.com/images/OQmYpGBwLK43uPoA-large.jpg Look along the upper left edge and you'll see the matching RF connector that plugs into the hole of the GPS receiver next to one of the screw holes that holds it tight against the back through the board mounting screws...the brass lined screw holes. The GPS antenna is under that plastic bubble marked with a circled WC-2 all along that edge to over by the brown folded circuit board to the right of WC-2. So, as you're holding the phone in the vertical viewing position with the docking connector pointed down, looking at the screen with your hand wrapped around it, The GPS antenna would be along the right side back edge (under your finger tips holding it with your left hand. To maximize GPS reception get your fingers off the back panel's rightside edge and hold the phone in your left hand by its left edge and you'll probably get bigger signals from the birds....(c; Sure would like to find out more information on that LBEE chip. The internet engines find nothing with that number on it..... Google is usually very good at finding even house numbers of ICs with a thousand websites trying to sell them to you.....With this number, nada... > internet engines find nothing with that number on it..... > > Google is usually very good at finding even house numbers of ICs with a > thousand websites trying to sell them to you.....With this number, nada... again, apple has always done a lot of custom work, so common chip numbers will rarely pull much up. you are dealing with an engineering firm, not a simple "carrier" like verizon or att, or just a "metoo" company like nokia. >>internet engines find nothing with that number on it..... >> >>Google is usually very good at finding even house numbers of ICs with a >>thousand websites trying to sell them to you.....With this number, nada... > > again, apple has always done a lot of custom work... Love that custom activation interface. "It is better to look mah-velous than to work..." Mah-velous! > >>Google is usually very good at finding even house numbers of ICs with a > >>thousand websites trying to sell them to you.....With this number, nada... > > > > again, apple has always done a lot of custom work... > > Love that custom activation interface. - :) yep! apple f.cked up, no question about it... heads will roll over that debacle. I guess in England it was technically O2's fault, but everywhere else seems to be squarely Apple's goof. trying to do a simultaneous, planetary rollout is just too complex. >>>>Google is usually very good at finding even house numbers of ICs with a >>>>thousand websites trying to sell them to you.....With this number, nada... [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > - :) yep! apple f.cked up, no question about it... Admitting to the problem is the first part of the twelve step program... > Sure would like to find out more information on that LBEE chip. The > internet engines find nothing with that number on it..... The GPS chip is Infineon's PMB 2525 Hammerhead II. http://www.techonline.com/product/underthehood/209000013?pgno=1 SignatureCharles >> Sure would like to find out more information on that LBEE chip. The >> internet engines find nothing with that number on it..... > > The GPS chip is Infineon's PMB 2525 Hammerhead II. > > http://www.techonline.com/product/underthehood/209000013?pgno=1 Yeah, I see it. The spec sheet says it's for sellphones, not GPS receivers. That must be why the video posted was wandering around in a couple of the realtime videos on the blogs. The ATT video on YouTube was edited so you couldn't see any time it went tits up as he was driving along...otherwise they would have left the camera pointing constantly at the phone...not little snippets of phone video driving straight mixed in with pictures of the ATT bureaucrat driving the car. It was edited out. > > The GPS chip is Infineon's PMB 2525 Hammerhead II. > > > > http://www.techonline.com/product/underthehood/209000013?pgno=1 > > Yeah, I see it. The spec sheet says it's for sellphones, not GPS > receivers. It's spec sheet says it's designed for cellphones because of it's tiny size- not because of any differences in performance. Car-navigation GPS receivers typically have more room under the hood and can get by with larger (cheaper) chips. Smaller is more expensive. > That must be why the video posted was wandering around in a > couple of the realtime videos on the blogs. The ATT video on YouTube was > edited so you couldn't see any time it went tits up as he was driving > along...otherwise they would have left the camera pointing constantly at > the phone...not little snippets of phone video driving straight mixed in > with pictures of the ATT bureaucrat driving the car. It was edited out. Your conspiracy-theory thinking at work, huh? The Hammerhead chips seem to get good reviews- a bit slower to first fix (less of an issue with cellphones, given AGPS assist) but as accurate as Sirf III chips, and (surprise!) TomTom, a respected GPS manufacturer, even uses them (the larger, cheaper, Hammerhead I chips) in some of their dedicated car-nav units. So, can we finally lay this iPhone GPS nonsense to rest? The iPhone 3G has a perfectly adequate, "real" satellite-based GPS under the hood. Any "problems" with it will stem from inadequate software (Google Maps only, so far) or unit placement. >>> Sure would like to find out more information on that LBEE chip. The >>> internet engines find nothing with that number on it..... [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > Yeah, I see it. The spec sheet says it's for sellphones, not GPS > receivers. No it doesn't, it says it is also for PDAs and "PNDs" (Personal Navigation Devices), which covers just about everything. The reason why they single out mobile phones for special mention is just because the chip apparently knows what to do with standard UMTS/GSM and CDMA assistance data when you have that available (note the 1 second TTFF), though it doesn't rely on it. > That must be why the video posted was wandering around in a > couple of the realtime videos on the blogs. The ATT video on YouTube was > edited so you couldn't see any time it went tits up as he was driving > along...otherwise they would have left the camera pointing constantly at > the phone...not little snippets of phone video driving straight mixed in > with pictures of the ATT bureaucrat driving the car. It was edited out. I think this is a different issue. Note the stuff about "Global Locate's Host-based architecture" in the glossy for the chip. Part of the GPS receiver is implemented as an application in the phone's central processor, which runs Unix and isn't likely to be real proficient at anything beyond the softest of real time requirements. They probably still have some application tuning to do to make it really good at this. Dennis Ferguson > Part of the > GPS receiver is implemented as an application in the phone's central > processor, which runs Unix and isn't likely to be real proficient at > anything beyond the softest of real time requirements. It's fantastic! Watch this! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iMYBjz3AU3Y > 70%. This is why the header to this post is they can't read. "Assisted > GPS" ISN'T a GPS installed inside the phone, from looking at the high You should actually learn what AGPS is. Signature--Tim Smith |
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