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Cellular Phone Forum / Country Specific / Australian Group / May 2005

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New mobile phones relaying messages to the towers?

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Greg Alexander - 30 May 2005 09:07 GMT
Interesting article on ABC news.
They're experimenting with mobile phones actually relaying signals for
other phones, in areas where tower coverage is sparse. Sounds
interesting.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/200505/s1380145.htm
Jeremy Quirke - 30 May 2005 10:00 GMT
> Interesting article on ABC news.
> They're experimenting with mobile phones actually relaying signals for
> other phones, in areas where tower coverage is sparse. Sounds
> interesting.
>
> http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/200505/s1380145.htm

Can't see this going anywhere - it can't easily be integrated into any
existing cellular system, which shift a lot of responsibility into the BSS
(base station) side of the network. For a start you won't achieve anywhere
near the range you can get from MS <-> BTS with MS <-> MS, due to relatively
'simple' antenna used on each with much lower transmit power. Then you have
the issues of latency as each phone relays the signal from hop to hop.
Further complicate that by a 'relay' node having to maintain two
connections - with a TDMA style system this would either mean forcing
single-frequency operation or using more complex hardware (which means that
adding this kind of functionality to existing technology through firmware
upgrades is out of the question). Add the likely unreliability of this
system on top of this. Then add the issue of my battery life draining
quickly because some guy near me wants to have a conversation routed through
my handset.. the list goes on.

This isn't the first time I've heard this idea entertained, but each time I
have it's been shot down, and rightly so.
Greg Alexander - 31 May 2005 00:38 GMT
Yes mobile phone-mobile phone connections are very limited. I imagine
this group are looking at far larger mobile phones. Nokia sells mobiles
that also do 2 way radio.

Battery life is another good point. If I was outback, I would happily
let someone piggy back SMS messages via my mobile, but I wouldn't want
to use up lots of battery by relaying voice calls. If it was a car
based phone with a big antenna etc that doesn't matter as much.

Greg
(ps... In fact, if the phone companies allowed it, you could buy a
repeater for your car or boat right now - have a big antenna which
connects to the phone networks, and a smaller retransmitter antenna
which allows any mobile phones nearby to use the repeater to get a
stronger signal out.)
The Family - 30 May 2005 16:14 GMT
Aside from a raft of technical issues, this will only work commercially if
there's a dollar in it for the big phone networks.  Otherwise, there will be
no major investment in getting the whole thing to work properly and it will
be, at best, a geek-driven and geek-isolated system.

> Interesting article on ABC news.
> They're experimenting with mobile phones actually relaying signals for
> other phones, in areas where tower coverage is sparse. Sounds
> interesting.
>
> http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/200505/s1380145.htm
Greg Alexander - 31 May 2005 00:30 GMT
At the moment the big phone networks subsidise the handsets - so
developing anything that doesn't use the big networks is not going to
get much investment. Same reason that mobile phones that connected to a
home base station didn't take off - you could've gotten a cheap plan
with expensive calls on vodafone (etc) with the phone subsidised, and
then never actually used vodafone.

Both Telstra and Vodafone have played with the concept of not
subsidising handsets, and lost market share when it happened. Still,
Nokia, Motorola, Ericsson are all designing handsets that roam to home
IP networks, public 802.11, and 3G... so something's gotta shift in the
big telcos.

I doubt it'd be a geek-isolated system simply because most geeks
already have mobile phone access. The kinds of people who NEED or could
use something like this are different.
Jeremy Quirke - 31 May 2005 06:21 GMT
> At the moment the big phone networks subsidise the handsets - so
> developing anything that doesn't use the big networks is not going to
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
> IP networks, public 802.11, and 3G... so something's gotta shift in the
> big telcos.

802.11 is laughable... with all the consumer grade (and indeed some of the
'better' brands like Cisco, etc) all I have ever got from 802.11* is an
interoperability headache. There's a long way to go before I can imagine
myself sitting in a coffee shop chatting away over a WiFi connection.
 
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