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Cellular Phone Forum / General / General Topics / September 2004Cell phone bands (GSM 1900?) at Disney World
I'm going to Walt Disney World and am trying to figure out whether my Ericsson A2218Z phone will work on the Cingular prepaid network there. I've searched Google Groups for past postings on the subject and found conflicting information: one that said that Orlando and eastern Florida were all on GSM 850; another from someone who said he used a GSM 1900 phone just fine throughout most of Disney World. Can anyone verify whether a 1900-only phone will work at WDW? If not, I'll upgrade to a dual-band 850/1900 phone before I leave. (There wouldn't be any difference in access between a 1900 phone on a monthly plan and a 1900 phone on a prepaid plan, would there? In other words, if someone tells me that he/she was able to use a 1900 MHz phone at WDW through a monthly service plan, I'd be fine with prepaid, right? Or do the cell phone companies use more restrictive coverage areas for prepaid customers?) Thanks! Patty You're going on vacation, leave that blasted thing at home! In case of an emergency, use a public phone. > I'm going to Walt Disney World and am trying to figure out > whether my Ericsson A2218Z phone will work on the Cingular [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > Thanks! > Patty >I'm going to Walt Disney World and am trying to figure out >whether my Ericsson A2218Z phone will work on the Cingular [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] >cell phone companies use more restrictive coverage areas >for prepaid customers?) Have you tried asking Cingular? I'll bet they know all the answers to your questions. >Thanks! >Patty  Signaturedillon When I was a kid, I thought the angel's name was Hark and the horse's name was Bob. >Have you tried asking Cingular? Yes, of course. I called them earlier today. That's how I found out that my phone might work in Florida, which I had not previously believed. >I'll bet they know all the answers to your questions. They referred me to the map on their website, which shows the entire 850/1900 coverage area for Cingular prepaid. It does not indicate which areas are 850 MHz and which areas are 1900 MHz. Patty > They referred me to the map on their website, which shows > the entire 850/1900 coverage area for Cingular prepaid. It > does not indicate which areas are 850 MHz and which areas > are 1900 MHz. There is a Cingular news group alt.cellular.cingular which may be of more assistance for you. SignatureIf a mute swears, does his mother wash his hands with soap? >Have you tried asking Cingular? I'll bet they know all the answers to >your questions. Have you tried asking a cellular company a yes or no question? If you call 5 times you will get five different answers. SignatureTo reply, remove TheObvious from my e-mail address. > I'm going to Walt Disney World and am trying to figure out > whether my Ericsson A2218Z phone will work on the Cingular > prepaid network there. I've searched Google Groups for past > postings on the subject and found conflicting information: > one that said that Orlando and eastern Florida Nevermind mobile-phone coverage, are you sure that Disney World is actually still standing ? Must have taken quite a battering by that hurricane. SignatureMichael Turner Email (ROT13) zvxr.gheare1963@ivetva.arg >Nevermind mobile-phone coverage, are you sure that Disney World is >actually still standing ? I've heard of a rat trap run by people but DisneyWorld? A people trap run by rats! SignatureTo reply, remove TheObvious from my e-mail address. >> are you sure that Disney World is actually still standing ? << It is standing, had very little damage from Frances, and is back to normal operating hours today. SignatureBob Richmond Remove "SPAMBEGONE" to reply by EMail. "... well uh, this is MY dream!" - Mickey Mouse in Fantasmic! > (There wouldn't be any difference in access between a 1900 > phone on a monthly plan and a 1900 phone on a prepaid plan, [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > cell phone companies use more restrictive coverage areas > for prepaid customers?) Yep, prepaid service areas are typically more restrictive. Many carriers form the coverage for their postpaid plans from some combination of their own network and the networks of other carriers they have bulk roaming agreements with. Prepaid plans, on the other hand, are often limited to the natively-owned network. This is the case with Cingular GSM prepaid -- Cingular network only, no roaming. [That isn't necessarily *entirely* true -- it seems that Cingular prepaid can use the AT&T network in some areas. Although that is not official, I've seen it happen at least once and tested it with calls in both directions. (A precursor to the upcoming merger, perhaps?) But that won't help you in Orlando, unfortunately, since both AT&T and Cingular are 800 MHz there.] The only carrier with 1900 MHz GSM in Orlando is, apparently, T-Mobile. It is very unlikely that Cingular prepaid will use that at all, but a lot less unlikely that Cingular and T-Mobile have an agreement to let postpaid customers use it. (T-Mobile probably fills a number of holes in Cingular's coverage in other parts of the country.) Unfortunately, you're probably stuck with one of three options: get a dual-band phone, make alternate service arrangements, or do without. For the first option, something like a Nokia 3595 should be cheap on eBay (make sure it's unlocked, locked to Cingular, or can be unlocked easily over the web). For the second, company-owned T-Mobile stores should be able to sell you a prepaid SIM that will work in your existing phone. (Of course in that case you'd be using a different number while at DisneyWorld... but at least you'll still be using your own phone.) Good luck, --Rob > I'm going to Walt Disney World and am trying to figure out > whether my Ericsson A2218Z phone will work on the Cingular [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > GSM 850; another from someone who said he used a GSM 1900 > phone just fine throughout most of Disney World. Look at: http://www.gsmworld.com/cgi/ni_map.pl5?z=2&x=17&y=16&cc=us&net=be Ive been there 2 years ago and as far as I remember Cingular was available. I had coverage but I am not sure if it was cingular. Oliver >http://www.gsmworld.com/cgi/ni_map.pl5?z=2&x=17&y=16&cc=us&net=be That's a much finer-gradation map than the one on the Cingular website for Florida, thanks. And when I click on the Network Information tab, it says "GSM 1900". But is that map really of the 1900 MHz network only? It isn't a combination of 1900 and 850? Patty > Can anyone verify whether a 1900-only phone will work at > WDW? If not, I'll upgrade to a dual-band 850/1900 phone > before I leave. I can confirm that in the Orlando area the two 1900mhz GSM operators are T-Mobile and AT&T Wireless. I roamed with both fine. >> Can anyone verify whether a 1900-only phone will work at >> WDW? If not, I'll upgrade to a dual-band 850/1900 phone >> before I leave. > >I can confirm that in the Orlando area the two 1900mhz GSM operators are >T-Mobile and AT&T Wireless. I roamed with both fine. But that's not what was asked! It was asked whether cingular GSM would work with a 1900 phone. It won't since cingular has no 1900 in Orlando. T-Mobile and AT&T Wireless do, but that won't help with a cingular prepaid since they use 850 there. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - > >I can confirm that in the Orlando area the two 1900mhz GSM operators are > >T-Mobile and AT&T Wireless. I roamed with both fine. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > Orlando. T-Mobile and AT&T Wireless do, but that won't help with a > cingular prepaid since they use 850 there. Therefore as I pointed out T-Mobile and AT&T Wireless exist in the Orlando area. Cingular do not - at least not on 1900mhz. They are all existant on Marco Island though, but that's not Orlando ;P >> >I can confirm that in the Orlando area the two 1900mhz GSM operators are >> >T-Mobile and AT&T Wireless. I roamed with both fine. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >Cingular do not - at least not on 1900mhz. They are all existant on Marco >Island though, but that's not Orlando ;P Which *still* doesn't help the poster since the poster wanted to know if cingular at 1900 would work there. It won't. cingular prepaid cannot roam on either AT&T Wireless or T-Mobile. So what really is your point other than to point out that there are services that the poster cannot use? - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - >I can confirm that in the Orlando area the two 1900mhz GSM operators are >T-Mobile and AT&T Wireless. I roamed with both fine. Okay, but as Joseph pointed out, I can't roam with a prepaid account. Unless Cingular has its own 1900 coverage in Orlando (and the map on GSM World indicates that it does, although Joseph and others have said that it doesn't), then my only hope is if Cingular has an agreement with T-Mobile to make T-Mobile's network part of the basic coverage area of Cingular prepaid customers in Orlando. I.e., basic, not roaming. I'm going to try calling Cingular again and see whether I can get bumped up to a tech support person... Patty > Okay, but as Joseph pointed out, I can't roam with a prepaid account. Correct. > Unless Cingular has its own 1900 coverage in Orlando (and the map on > GSM World indicates that it does, although Joseph and others have > said that it doesn't) They don't. Cingular is 800MHz in Orlando. They'll acquire AT&T's 1900 when the merger happens later this year, but for now you'll need either an 800 (aka 850)/1900 phone, or a T-Mobile prepaid SIM (available on eBay pretty cheap) assuming your phone is unlocked (or can be). > then my only hope is if Cingular has an agreement > with T-Mobile to make T-Mobile's network part of the basic coverage area > of Cingular prepaid customers in Orlando. I.e., basic, not roaming. I would be stunned if they did- there'd be no economic incentive for them to do that. I think I've finally gotten a definitive answer to my question. I called Cingular customer service again and got the rep to transfer me to tech support. The guy there said that Cingular's network in Florida is both 850 and 1900 MHz GSM, so my phone will be fine. Here is the apparent source of the confusion: Until June, Cingular only had an 850 MHz analog TDMA network. Then it was switched to 850/1900 GSM digital. So anyone who hadn't heard about the very recent change would naturally think that Cingular was still only 850 in that area. Because I have Cingular prepaid, my current account only works in California and parts of Nevada and Washington. So I will have to purchase a new SIM when I arrive in Orlando, but that won't cost too much. Thanks to everyone for your help in sorting this out. I'll post a report in a few months after I return from Florida! Patty >Because I have Cingular prepaid, my current account only works in >California and parts of Nevada and Washington. So I will have to >purchase a new SIM when I arrive in Orlando, but that won't cost >too much. Why bother getting a cingular prepaid that will only work in some areas? Get a T-Mobile prepaid SIM either from a T-Mobile store or on ebay for as little as $25. T-Mobile's prepaid will work throughout their system including Washington and Orlando. Of course you'll require that your handset is unlocked. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - > I think I've finally gotten a definitive answer to my question. > I called Cingular customer service again and got the rep to > transfer me to tech support. The guy there said that Cingular's > network in Florida is both 850 and 1900 MHz GSM, so my phone will > be fine. That's good news. > Here is the apparent source of the confusion: Until June, Cingular > only had an 850 MHz analog TDMA network. Then it was switched to > 850/1900 GSM digital. So anyone who hadn't heard about the very > recent change would naturally think that Cingular was still only > 850 in that area. Kinda sorta- cellular licenses (frequencies) are purchased, and have nothing to do with the technology used on them. Cingular's conversion from TDMA to GSM doesn't automatically give them the license to operate at 1900MHz. Having said that, I just checked wirelessadvisor.com and noticed that while they show Cingular only having an 800MHz license, Nextwave is listed as having a 1900MHz one. Cingular bought all of Nextwave's licenses back in April, and wirelessadvisor has apparently never updated those lists. (Long story short, Nextwave was a company that bought a bunch of 1900MHz licenses around the country but went bankrupt before even using them. Cingular bought 34 of them, including Orlando, earlier this year.) > Thanks to everyone for your help in sorting this out. I'll post > a report in a few months after I return from Florida! Enjoy the trip! > (Long story >short, Everyone is trying to bastardize old sayings these days to keep from typing a few extra words. This particular bastardization always gauls me and if I hadn't just had a conversation about it yesterday probably wouldn't have written anything. The old saying is - To make a long story short, -- John S. e-mail responses to - john at kiana dot net > The guy there said that Cingular's >network in Florida is both 850 and 1900 MHz GSM, so my phone will >be fine. But, but, but...... Where it is 800 it is JUST 800 and where it is 1900 it is JUST 1900. Yes, in Florida there are both spectrums but no where that I know of is it both in the same market. I just finished 3 COWS to go to Florida for disaster relief. We did 2 at 800 and 1 at 1900 because there was uncertainty where the COWS might be needed after the storm passed. -- John S. e-mail responses to - john at kiana dot net If this is true, why not follow current technology and trending, and make capable of both bands, simple, easy, and no coverage problems no matter where they end up, whether Florida, Georgia or any place else in the US. I hope Cinguilar is not that stupid to order something so limited. AL > > The guy there said that Cingular's > >network in Florida is both 850 and 1900 MHz GSM, so my phone will [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > John S. > e-mail responses to - john at kiana dot net > If this is true, why not follow current technology and trending, and make > capable of both bands, simple, easy, and no coverage problems no matter > where they end up, whether Florida, Georgia or any place else in the US. > > I hope Cinguilar is not that stupid to order something so limited. Up to this point, cingular only has 1900Mhz GMS in California. 1900Mhz only phones were sold. And the fact that a lot of them came from Tmobile. After the by out, then they will have 800/1900. All the cingular 1900 only phones disappeared from the shelves. They are making sure that the new users will be able to fully use the new network. >Up to this point, cingular only has 1900Mhz GMS in California. Not true! cingular is also 1900 Mhz only in the Carolinas and in some other small areas. >1900Mhz only phones were sold. >And the fact that a lot of them came from Tmobile. Huh? What hat did you pull that one out of? cingular has been selling dual band 850/1900 phones since they started rolling out GSM 850. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - I live in the Carolinas and only having a 1900 network is a pain. So I was disappointed that Cingular did not pick up any 800 mhz spectrum in the Carolinas. Chip >>Up to this point, cingular only has 1900Mhz GMS in California. > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - >I live in the Carolinas and only having a 1900 network is a pain. And why is it a "pain?" - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - >>I live in the Carolinas and only having a 1900 network is a pain. > > And why is it a "pain?" > > - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - > Because it leads to lower coverage because there have to be more towers. Cingular has terrible mountain coverage because of this Chip I had good GSM coverage at DisneyWorld last December. Mostly I was on AT&T but occasionally I was on T-Mobile. I had an 850/1900 phone but I'm not sure if either provider has 850 service there. Jim Jim, Florida has good coverage, I will concede that absolutely. It is the mountians of western North carolina that 1900 fails. you need to many towers and Cingular has bad coverage there. My family has taken may vacations there and not having cell coverage is very incovinent. Many of the main tourist traps are not covered, like cheerokee, nc. These places just have be covered. (Sprint does not have the problem because they roam over to Altel or Verizon). Like it or not, people just expect there cell phone to work everywhere. IMHO > I had good GSM coverage at DisneyWorld last December. Mostly I was on AT&T > but occasionally I was on T-Mobile. I had an 850/1900 phone but I'm not > sure if either provider has 850 service there. > > Jim > Florida has good coverage, I will concede that absolutely. > > It is the mountians of western North carolina that 1900 fails. We have the same issue. One network here in Canada, Fido, has done well with 1900 only. Its coverage density is as good as anybody's and better in most cases, despite the lesser signal propogation. Their network is smaller, though. However, it proves that good 1900 networks can be built. Our TDMA provider, Rogers, retrofitted its network with GSM 1900 and found that it had a lot of coverage holes because the tower spacing was built for 850. Once it retrofitted again with GSM 850, network coverage became quite good again. You're right - people do expect phones to work everywhere and they don't. Where I live (Saskatchewan), there are a lot of places where phones don't work. That's just the way it is. Choose your network according to its cost and your needs for coverage. Jim >My family has taken may vacations there and not having cell coverage is >very incovinent. What about June? :) - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - >Like it or not, people just expect there cell phone to work everywhere. Oy! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - >Like it or not, people just expect there cell phone to work everywhere. People *want* them to work everyone, but only the unrealistic *expect* them to. SignatureBest regards, HELP FOR CINGULAR GSM & SONY ERICSSON PHONES: John Navas <http://navasgrp.home.att.net/#Cingular Just returned from maybe our 70th visit.......... no, not kidding-- just stupid! Have used AT&T, Verizon, and Cingular. This trip--Cingular. V600, so all 4 bands enabled, I believe. (GSM only......) Worst coverage of these 3 carriers was Cingular, by far. IMHO! John >>>I live in the Carolinas and only having a 1900 network is a pain. >> [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > Chip John, I have never had anyproblems at Disney. Chip > Just returned from maybe our 70th visit.......... no, not kidding-- just > stupid! [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] >> >>Chip >>>I live in the Carolinas and only having a 1900 network is a pain. >> >> And why is it a "pain?" >Because it leads to lower coverage because there have to be more towers. It's the same number of towers for both bands -- both have the same range. >Cingular has terrible mountain coverage because of this The two bands do differ in certain propagation characteristics, but not in mountain coverage. SignatureBest regards, HELP FOR CINGULAR GSM & SONY ERICSSON PHONES: John Navas <http://navasgrp.home.att.net/#Cingular > It's the same number of towers for both bands -- both have the same range. > > The two bands do differ in certain propagation characteristics, but not in > mountain coverage. I agree that mountains ought not to affect the coverage much because the signal is far more limited by the physical terrain than by the propogation characteristics of the frequency, but 800-ish MHz signals do travel further than 1900 MHz signals. The lower the frequency, the further, generally, it will travel and still be able to be clearly received. As a simple example, see how much easier it is to pick up distant AM radio signals at the 530 kHz end of the band than it is at the 1700 kHz end. Jim To: all of you in the group i work for Cingular Wirless have for the last three years. > If this is true, why not follow current technology and trending, and make > capable of both bands, simple, easy, and no coverage problems no matter [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] >> John S. >> e-mail responses to - john at kiana dot net > To: all of you in the group i work for Cingular Wirless have for the last > three years. And...? SignatureJustThe.net Internet & New Media Services, http://JustThe.net/ Steven J. Sobol, Geek In Charge / 888.480.4NET (4638) / sjsobol@JustThe.net PGP Key available from your friendly local key server (0xE3AE35ED) Apple Valley, California Nothing scares me anymore. I have three kids. >To: all of you in the group i work for Cingular Wirless have for the last >three years. Well, I don't. What's your point? Are we supposed to be impressed now and be glad that we have other "experts" other than John H. and John Navas? - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - > To: all of you in the group i work for Cingular Wirless have for the last > three years. Great, then tell us, what is the direct number to the tech assist? >> To: all of you in the group i work for Cingular Wirless have for the last >> three years. > Great, then tell us, what is the direct number to the tech assist? Cingular WIRLESS? > > The guy there said that Cingular's > >network in Florida is both 850 and 1900 MHz GSM, so my phone will > >be fine. > > But, but, but...... Where it is 800 it is JUST 800 and where it is 1900 it is > JUST 1900. Cingular purchased 34 1900MHz PCS licenses from Nextwave, the majority of which were in their 800MHz markets to add additional bandwidth in congested markets. Therefore, in the Tampa market (which includes Orlando) they control 30MHz of the 800 band, and 20MHz of 1900. > Yes, in Florida there are both spectrums but no where that I know of > is it both in the same market. AT&T does this all of the time. Here in Denver (as well as Tampa/Orlando) they operate in both 800 and 1900. In AT&T's case, in dual-band markets they generally ran AMPS/TDMA at 800 and GSM at 1900. I suspect some of the 800 is being switched to GSM, but you'd know more about that! > > (Long story short > Everyone is trying to bastardize old sayings these days to keep from typing > a few extra words. My apologies, but there's a difference between abbreviation and bastardization: for example, "the whole ten yards" is a bastardization of the original "whole nine yards" because the modern generation thinks the expression refers to the sport of football. > >The old saying is - To make a long story short Obviously. However, when an old expression or quotation is so well known or overused that it has become a cliche, it's common to abbreviate it since the listener/reader knows the expression so well a complete reiteration is unnecessary; for example- "...but for the grace of God...", "a bird in the hand...", "when in Rome...", etc. You obviously recognized my "bastardization" well-enough to fill in the rest, so what harm was done? Regardless, (I toyed with typing "irregardless" just to get a rise out of you!) I apologize again if I offended your linguistic sensibilities. >>> The guy there said that Cingular's >>> network in Florida is both 850 and 1900 MHz GSM, so my phone will [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > congested markets. Therefore, in the Tampa market (which includes > Orlando) they control 30MHz of the 800 band, and 20MHz of 1900. That's not quite correct. Cingular has no 800 MHz spectrum in Tampa yet, and when the ATTWS purchase closes it will gain the 25 MHz cellular A-band. Alltel has the B-band license. Cingular does have the cellular B-band 25 MHz license in Orlando. I'll accept your figures on the PCS bandwidth. John C. |
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