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Cellular Phone Forum / Providers / Cingular / January 2005Verizon's answer to lawsuits?
Rather than argue over what folks' Bluetooth expectations are/should be, and what the wording is on their website and what salesman/brochures say about Bluetooth: VerizonWireless will respond: You have a 15 day trial period with the phone which should have given you ample opportunity to discover any real/perceived/imagined shortcomings. "We provide a 15-day satisfaction guarantee on any product you buy from us." > Subject: Verizon's answer to lawsuits? > From: Jack Zwick <jzwick3@mindspring.com> [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > shortcomings. "We provide a 15-day satisfaction guarantee on any product > you buy from us." FWIW: I've had sales folks tell me outright "Oh yea, feature X will definitely be support in 3-6 months ... once we get the bugs out of it." Usually they are blowing sunshine up your butt, but in this case if they did just they then they may have inadvertently created this problem. (I never asked them to put such remarks in writing because I knew they were full of it .... but if someone believed them at face value ....) Just because they give a very short 15 day return policy, doesn't mean they can false advertise to the masses. Hell, if that's the case...I'll open up a business and false advertise all the products and services sell to make some volume sales and then when there's a problem or a dispute I'll respond with: "You have a 15 day trial period with the phone which should have given you ample opportunity to discover any real/perceived/imagined shortcomings. "We provide a 15-day satisfaction guarantee on any product you buy from us." Hey, all Verizon will do is give the opposition free cell phone service for life and there goes the case. Yes, that happens. > Rather than argue over what folks' Bluetooth expectations are/should be, > and what the wording is on their website and what salesman/brochures say [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > shortcomings. "We provide a 15-day satisfaction guarantee on any product > you buy from us." > Rather than argue over what folks' Bluetooth expectations are/should be, > and what the wording is on their website and what salesman/brochures say [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > shortcomings. "We provide a 15-day satisfaction guarantee on any product > you buy from us." Well, it WOULD be pretty easy to determine whether the required features are present within 15 minutes. I agree with your comments elsewhere that Verizon is marketing BT capabilities of the Moto 710 in a misleading manner, but the opportunity does exist to test the phone, discover it's not what you need, and cancel or try another phone.  SignatureJustThe.net - Apple Valley, CA - http://JustThe.net/ - 888.480.4NET (4638) Steven J. Sobol, Geek In Charge / sjsobol@JustThe.net / PGP: 0xE3AE35ED "In case anyone was wondering, that big glowing globe above the Victor Valley is the sun." -Victorville _Daily Press_ on the unusually large amount of rain the Southland has gotten this winter (January 12th, 2005) False advertising is illegal, no? People are buying this phone on the premise on what they've read...not what they think will happen when they test it. > > Rather than argue over what folks' Bluetooth expectations are/should be, > > and what the wording is on their website and what salesman/brochures say [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > opportunity does exist to test the phone, discover it's not what you need, and > cancel or try another phone. > False advertising is illegal, no? > People are buying this phone on the premise on what they've read...not what > they think will happen when they test it. If you can return the phone without penalty, what's the problem? If you can return the phone and not be out any money or be locked into a contract, what have you lost? Yes, I think Verizon should fix its advertising. However, they do at least give you an out. SignatureJustThe.net - Apple Valley, CA - http://JustThe.net/ - 888.480.4NET (4638) Steven J. Sobol, Geek In Charge / sjsobol@JustThe.net / PGP: 0xE3AE35ED "In case anyone was wondering, that big glowing globe above the Victor Valley is the sun." -Victorville _Daily Press_ on the unusually large amount of rain the Southland has gotten this winter (January 12th, 2005) And for those that didn't have enough time to test their hardware out should suffer based upon that false advertising? You seem very loose and very passive about Verizon's false advertising..just as long as there's an out isn't good enough for some one that missed the very short 15day deadline. > > False advertising is illegal, no? > > People are buying this phone on the premise on what they've read...not what [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > Yes, I think Verizon should fix its advertising. However, they do at least give > you an out. > And for those that didn't have enough time to test their hardware How long does it take to set up something like this? GMAFB. SignatureJustThe.net - Apple Valley, CA - http://JustThe.net/ - 888.480.4NET (4638) Steven J. Sobol, Geek In Charge / sjsobol@JustThe.net / PGP: 0xE3AE35ED "In case anyone was wondering, that big glowing globe above the Victor Valley is the sun." -Victorville _Daily Press_ on the unusually large amount of rain the Southland has gotten this winter (January 12th, 2005) Steve, you're missing the entire point of false advertising. You're literally "stuck" on post purchase for some reason and can't get passed that it's truly false advertising regardless if some one tested their bluetooth hardware or not. My gad man...you'd be a GREAT customer service person for this company....telling them that you should have tested it out prior to the 15 day trial period and too bad, your screwed now since our false advertising sucked you in on the buy. I thought I was a dick. What you're saying in other words is some thing I wouldn't imagine on anyone. > > And for those that didn't have enough time to test their hardware > > How long does it take to set up something like this? > > GMAFB. There was no false advertising. There was time to check it out. Thus no real issue. >Steve, you're missing the entire point of false advertising. You're >literally "stuck" on post purchase for some reason and can't get passed that [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] >> >> GMAFB. SignatureBest regards, HELP FOR CINGULAR GSM & SONY ERICSSON PHONES: John Navas <http://navasgrp.home.att.net/#Cingular > Steve, you're missing the entire point of false advertising. You're > literally "stuck" on post purchase for some reason and can't get passed that [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > 15 day trial period and too bad, your screwed now since our false > advertising sucked you in on the buy. Heh. The manager at the Victorville VZW store supposedly wanted to hire me for a CS position there, and Verizon has a major presence in Victorville, including a VZW retail store, a Verizon Plus retail store (wireless/VZ landline/DSL), and a call center that handles 411 for VZ and VZW customers, among others. I could get a Verizon job very easily if I wanted one. After my recent experiences with the company, however, I don't think that I could stomach working for them. :) Anyhow, my point was that if you were to sue, you'd have to show some kind of loss, and the judge might be likely to point out that you had an out and therefore possibly rule against you. > I thought I was a dick. What you're saying in other words is some thing I > wouldn't imagine on anyone. Yeah, well, I'm obviously a Verizon shill, right? After all, I've said SO many good things about them lately :D SignatureJustThe.net - Apple Valley, CA - http://JustThe.net/ - 888.480.4NET (4638) Steven J. Sobol, Geek In Charge / sjsobol@JustThe.net / PGP: 0xE3AE35ED "In case anyone was wondering, that big glowing globe above the Victor Valley is the sun." -Victorville _Daily Press_ on the unusually large amount of rain the Southland has gotten this winter (January 12th, 2005) > And for those that didn't have enough time to test their hardware out > should suffer based upon that false advertising? You seem very loose [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] >> unusually large amount of rain the Southland has gotten this winter >> (January 12th, 2005) When we signed up for VZW AC and got new phones - we made full use of the 15 day trial. We planned ahead so we could try the phones locally - then took a three day raod trip to check where we go most often. That way we were fairly sure that VZW AC would work where we wanted to use our phones - and - got to do a lot of visiting with friends and family! >And for those that didn't have enough time to test their hardware out should >suffer based upon that false advertising? Yes. >You seem very loose and very >passive about Verizon's false advertising..just as long as there's an out >isn't good enough for some one that missed the very short 15day deadline. If they can't do that, then don't buy. >> > False advertising is illegal, no? >> > People are buying this phone on the premise on what they've read...not [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] >give >> you an out. SignatureBest regards, HELP FOR CINGULAR GSM & SONY ERICSSON PHONES: John Navas <http://navasgrp.home.att.net/#Cingular >False advertising is illegal, no? Yes, but this isn't that. >People are buying this phone on the premise on what they've read...not what >they think will happen when they test it. I see no evidence of that. SignatureBest regards, HELP FOR CINGULAR GSM & SONY ERICSSON PHONES: John Navas <http://navasgrp.home.att.net/#Cingular > [POSTED TO alt.cellular.cingular - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE] > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > I see no evidence of that. From your responses, you're just a dick. Plain and simple. You really could care less if Verizon Wireless advertises certain functions of a Bluetooth phone, but then cripple those same functions it advertises. If you want to actually blame the consumer because they didn't test it within 15 days and completely disregard the false advertising still stands then you're pretty much on the side of big brother and really wouldn't stick up for anyone if they had a problem. You'd be another great asset to a company like Verizon. Or any other type of customer service company. You'd stick it right to them, with a nice big smile. I'm an a.shole some times and maybe get into heated arguments with people...but you're just a dick and have no empathy for the poor people that were lured in by false Bluetooth advertising. sh.t, there's a lawsuit on it! >> I see no evidence of that. >From your responses, you're just a dick. Plain and simple. From your responses, you're just a rude jerk. Plain and simple. >You really could >care less if Verizon Wireless advertises certain functions of a Bluetooth >phone, but then cripple those same functions it advertises. It isn't advertising any crippled functions. >If you want to >actually blame the consumer because they didn't test it within 15 days and >completely disregard the false advertising still stands then you're pretty >much on the side of big brother and really wouldn't stick up for anyone if >they had a problem. There is no false advertising. >You'd be another great asset to a company like Verizon. >Or any other type of customer service company. You'd stick it right to them, >with a nice big smile. I'm an a.shole some times and maybe get into heated >arguments with people...but you're just a dick and have no empathy for the >poor people that were lured in by false Bluetooth advertising. There is no false advertising. >sh.t, there's >a lawsuit on it! Which means nothing. SignatureBest regards, HELP FOR CINGULAR GSM & SONY ERICSSON PHONES: John Navas <http://navasgrp.home.att.net/#Cingular> > >> I see no evidence of that. > [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > There is no false advertising. Thats what the lawsuit will determine, not your pontification. >> >> I see no evidence of that. >> [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > >Thats what the lawsuit will determine, not your pontification. Fair enough: Thus far there hasn't been a showing of anything even remotely close to false advertising, just vague claims. You can only pursue a case for misrepresentation by showing: (1) statements with alleged misrepresentation and (2) showing the representations in those statements to be false or misleading. Since Verizon has disclosed what the Bluetooth implementation would do, and since there hasn't been any showing of actual misrepresentation, there can't be a case for misrepresentation. SignatureBest regards, HELP FOR CINGULAR GSM & SONY ERICSSON PHONES: John Navas <http://navasgrp.home.att.net/#Cingular> Of course we all know what will happen. Everything will settle out of the court system because Verizon Wireless doesn't want the bad publicity. > [POSTED TO alt.cellular.cingular - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE] > [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > and (2) showing the representations in those statements to be false or > misleading. Since Verizon has disclosed what the Bluetooth implementation > would do, and since there hasn't been any showing of actual misrepresentation, > there can't be a case for misrepresentation. You're still an idiot and really do sound like a broken record. At least I put a little spin on some of my posts and actually have a thought behind to some of the things I say. Idiot, if the lawsuit does pass and it does become some thing...what in the world are you going to say since all you seem to be able to say is "there is no false advertising". I know...you'll be able to say nothing since you really can't think on your own and you're actually too scared to even consider the fact that you could be wrong about some thing publicly. I guess time will tell....and I don't expect anything exciting from your response. > [POSTED TO alt.cellular.cingular - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE] > [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] > > Which means nothing. >You're still an idiot and really do sound like a broken record. At least I >put a little spin on some of my posts and actually have a thought behind to [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >publicly. >I guess time will tell.... It will indeed. I'm willing to bet that this doesn't even get certified as a class action. Care to take me up on that? ;-) SignatureBest regards, HELP FOR CINGULAR GSM & SONY ERICSSON PHONES: John Navas <http://navasgrp.home.att.net/#Cingular> > > In <10uljevl4l7g27c@corp.supernews.com> on Sun, 16 Jan 2005 > 15:26:06 -0500, > > > > >False advertising is illegal, no? > > > > Yes, but this isn't that. Thats what a trial of the lawsuit will determine, not your pontification. > > >People are buying this phone on the premise on what they've read...not > what > > >they think will happen when they test it. > > > > I see no evidence of that. The lawsuit is evidence of that. >> > In <10uljevl4l7g27c@corp.supernews.com> on Sun, 16 Jan 2005 >> 15:26:06 -0500, [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >Thats what a trial of the lawsuit will determine, not your >pontification. You can only pursue a case for misrepresentation by showing: (1) statements with alleged misrepresentation and (2) showing the representations in those statements to be false or misleading. Since Verizon has disclosed what the Bluetooth implementation would do, and since there hasn't been any showing of actual misrepresentation, there can't be a case for misrepresentation. >> > >People are buying this phone on the premise on what they've read...not >> what [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >The lawsuit is evidence of that. A lawsuit isn't evidence of anything. SignatureBest regards, John Navas <http://navasgrp.home.att.net/> "A little learning is a dangerous thing." [Alexander Pope] "It is better to sit in silence and appear ignorant, than to open your mouth and remove all doubt." [Mark Twain] |
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