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Cellular Phone Forum / Providers / Cingular / August 2005confused about Cingular data plans
Since my "Media Net Pay Per Use" plan apparently only allows the phone (WAP.CINGULAR.COM), but not a tethered computer (ISP.CINGULAR.COM), access to the internet, I asked the support person to sign me up for tethered GPRS access. A session with that used 3MB in 22 minutes (roughly 19.2Kbaud) with ping times ranging from 900 to 3800ms. Extremely painful. On return home I find under My Features that I've still got Media Net Pay Per Use, plus "Data Connect" and "EDGE WIRELESS CA ELA" for $0, and "Data Connect 5MB" at $19.99/mo. At www.cingular.com/media/media_net_purchase I see "Media Net" packages ranging from Pay Per Use to Unlimited at $19.99, with no indication whether any of these let you tether or not. There's also "Media Basic" and "Media Works" bundles which add text and multimedia messages, which I rarely or never use, and, under Media Works ($19.99/mo), 5MB of Media Net. No mention of "Data Connect" or which packages support tethering. How can I find out what I actually have, and how can I get what I want, which is occasional remote tethering, preferably at a low price when not using it. What about speed? I've seen things here saying 190Kb is typical for GPRS, but others say you get 1-4 slots at 9600 baud/slot, which would be 38.4Kbaud maximum. I'm using a Nokia 6200 - would be newer phone make a difference? > Since my "Media Net Pay Per Use" plan apparently only allows the phone > (WAP.CINGULAR.COM), but not a tethered computer (ISP.CINGULAR.COM), access That's a difference in sales pitch, not much in functionality, although ISP allows some "acceleration". > Connect 5MB" at $19.99/mo. At www.cingular.com/media/media_net_purchase I > see "Media Net" packages ranging from Pay Per Use to Unlimited at $19.99, [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > 5MB of Media Net. No mention of "Data Connect" or which packages support > tethering. Isn't that odd... ;-) The data connect plans only appear on the business pages. There is the $80 ISP.cingular plan and a $44 plan for unlimited PDA access. http://www.cingular.com/sbusiness/data_connect There is the $20 WAP.cingular plan on the MediaNet pages. https://www.cingular.com/media/media_net_purchase It's also a little tough to spot which phones do tethering, since it isn't obviously differentiated from in-the-phone WAP-web access. > How can I find out what I actually have, and how can I get what I want, > which is occasional remote tethering, preferably at a low price when > not using it. I think Media Works at $19.99 with the WAP login is going to be fine for me, because I do want the messages. If I didn't want the messages, I would get unlimited MediaNet with the WAP login. That will give me 5MB of data in the plan, and additional KB pay-as-you-go, which I think will work out for me. You can see your daily usage on line at cingular.com. If I go out of town on a business trip, I might change to unlimited, and then back when I get home. > What about speed? I've seen things here saying 190Kb is typical for > GPRS, but others say you get 1-4 slots at 9600 baud/slot, which would be > 38.4Kbaud maximum. I'm using a Nokia 6200 - would be newer phone make > a difference? Different phones are different, and so is the effect of other data usage on the same cell site. I get anywhere from 3KBpS on a GPRS-only site to 9KBpS on an EDGE site with my V551. Earlier, John Navas <spamfilter0@navasgroup.com> wrote: > The V551 is only EGPRS (EDGE) Class 4, which is significantly slower (up > to about 100 Kbps) than Class 10 (up to about 150 Kbps), the maximum > supported by Cingular. A Google search of alt.cingular.cellular for "EDGE/GPRS Shootout: V551, GC82, Z600" from John Navas. http://makeashorterlink.com/?G1DB23E8B The instructions about WAP verses ISP logins can be found on many pages. John has some "phone=specific" pages that apply generically, on his web site. http://navasgrp.home.att.net/tech/cingular/  Signature--- Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley (Lake County) CA USA 38.8,-122.5 > > Since my "Media Net Pay Per Use" plan apparently only allows the phone > > (WAP.CINGULAR.COM), but not a tethered computer (ISP.CINGULAR.COM), access > > That's a difference in sales pitch, not much in functionality, although ISP > allows some "acceleration". I had my computer configured for WAP.CINGULAR.COM and when it would try to login the phone showed "Must sign up for GPRS first". So I called Cingular and the fellow said WAP is only in-the-phone and could only go to Cingular stuff. Since I wanted to check email, google, etc, he said I needed ISP.CINGULAR.COM, which would cost $19.99 After he did something, I was indeed able to check email, google, etc. So it appears to me that WAP and ISP are very different things. No? > to me that WAP and ISP are very different things. No? They are different logins. I can tether and log in with WAP. I can't log in with ISP. I have MediaBasic, which was added without comment when I bought the phone. I didn't ask for it. I believe that a WAP login is buried in the phone, for it to browse the web. I don't know if it's important, but I went http://www.cingular.com/media/media_net and enabled my MediaNet account. John mentions something you should specifically ask for by phone, but I didn't do that. I cannot log in with ISP, but I can log in with WAP. I currently have MediaBasic and MediaNet 1MB, which gives unlimited data for one month as a sign up promotion. https://www.cingular.com/media/media_net_purchase Signature--- Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley (Lake County) CA USA 38.8,-122.5 ...So I called Cingular and the fellow said WAP is only in-the-phone and could only go to Cingular stuff. .... You were misled. While Cingular prefers that WAP be used for phone only, it actually works with tethered phones for all intenet protocols and sites of interest. The specific language often used by CS is something like "tethered use is not supported..." This means they won't help you with it, not that it doesn't work. It also probably means that there's no promise it'll continue to work as it does today. Dave > While Cingular prefers that WAP be used for phone > only, it actually works with tethered phones for all intenet protocols > and sites of interest. When I tried WAP.CINGULAR.COM, my phone screen said "You must sign up for GPRS first". When the support guy had signed me up for whatever he signed me up for, and I had changed my connection name to "ISP.CINGULAR.COM", then things worked. So I take it you are saying I didn't need to change from WAP to ISP? That's interesting, but what would be even more interesting would be how I can pay less than $19.99/mo in the many months when I don't tether or use multimedia messaging, or send a thousand text messages, and how I can get more than 5MB in a month when I take a trip and do tether. Still confused. >> While Cingular prefers that WAP be used for phone >> only, it actually works with tethered phones for all intenet protocols [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > take a trip and do tether. > Still confused. Unfortunately, IMHO, it's difficult to get what you are asking for unless you want to pay for useage by the KB. With a WAP plan you can get all-you-can-eat for $24.99 (used to be $19.99) and you can tether you phone to a PDA or a laptop (I have done both). You can get a less expensive plan that allows for a minimal amount of data plus a per KB charge for anything over the amount included in the plan. I guess it would depend on how often you travel and need more than 5MB/month as to whether the unlimited plan is better for you. Cheers TC tony is correct. it costs $24.99/mo to get "Media Net Unlimited" which uses the WAP system and can be tethered to a computer. it is unlimited & there is no cost per kb. it does not use an http accelerator. username: WAP@CINGULARGPRS.COM password: CINGULAR1 there is no unlimited data $19.99 feature I'm aware of. sorry I didn't make the feature name clear. I recommend you find out what you are signed up for. If it is not "Media Net Unlimited" you may see big charges when you exceed your monthly kb allocation. There'll be no penalty to change your feature to "Media Net Unlimited". as these things are "features" not "plans" they can be turned on & off at will without penalty by calling CS. Dave I've heard that using isp.cingular... always results in kb charging but I've never tried it. > tony is correct. it costs $24.99/mo to get "Media Net Unlimited" which > uses the WAP system and can be tethered to a computer. > I recommend you find out what you are signed up for. If it is not > "Media Net Unlimited" you may see big charges when you exceed your > monthly kb allocation. There'll be no penalty to change your feature to > "Media Net Unlimited". https://www.cingular.com/media/media_net_purchase I don't see anything at $24.99. It's $19.99 on the web, with unlimited for the first month on any plan, if you sign up before September 24. The first month should always be unlimited, to give you an idea of what usage is. I see around 40K any time I use my phone to do anything on the web. Signature--- Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley (Lake County) CA USA 38.8,-122.5 You may be right. I no longer see Unlimited Media Net as an availible option for my particular existing account. However, when I look at https://www.cingular.com/media/media_net_purchase , it is listed at $19.99. I'd call CS & ask if the unlimited option is only for the first month. If it goes beyond the first month it is a worthwhile thing to have. > You may be right. I no longer see Unlimited Media Net as an availible > option for my particular existing account. Unlimited data used to be part of the MediaWorks package, which includes messaging and data. That is now 5MB data, and there is no unlimited MediaWorks package. There is still unlimited MediaNet, though. > However, when I look at > https://www.cingular.com/media/media_net_purchase , it is listed at > $19.99. > I'd call CS & ask if the unlimited option is only for the first month. > If it goes beyond the first month it is a worthwhile thing to have. I didn't phrase my "first month" comment correctly. Any of the Media Net plans are given unlimited access for one month as a promotional special until September 24th. What I meant to say is that either Cingular should extend this "first month" offer permanently, or a wise individual user might select unlimited if they intended to do any tethered usage, until they determined what their level of usage was going to be. Signature--- Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley (Lake County) CA USA 38.8,-122.5 You need to have the Pay per use removed from your acct because the billing system will allow the feature to take precedence over the Works pkg or any other data plan that you have. My understanding is that if you tether to a Laptop you have to have a Data Connect plan not a media net acct. I used to have a P900 and used the old Media Works pkg 19.99 unlmtd data but after checking with a tech supervisor I was told that it was against policy and needed to be under a PDA plan. If I used the blue tooth or data connect cable to tether to my laptop I was told that I have to use a Data connect plan. I know a lot of people that are on the old unlmtd works pkg and using it to tether to a laptop and are getting away with it but it does " the data usage" raise a red flag with revenue assurance and they will catch it eventually. Cingular is scraping the bottom of the barrel for cash. The data plans are much more expensive than the works or basic pkg but if you use a laptop my guess is your usage is around 80 to 130 MB per month ; I was using about 42 mb with my P900 with Opera browser. Data packaging is very confusing with Cingular and most if not all reps have had no training on the differences. I have even had some tier 2 techs call me with data plan concerns. The new Sony Vaio comes to mind because are billing system does not have a current plan with WIFI connectivity. The laptop comes with a WIFI card built into the machine and the only plan we have currently in our system is a data connect plan with GPRS Edge connection. My suggestion is to plan a day where you can go into a business service center that are usually connected to a Corp location and get a rep there at the store that can get your acct configured correctly. Do not call the call center because as I said before very few reps know the differences between the plans. I saw a Blackberry user with 92 different work order req in 1 week; all she was trying to do was get a data only plan for her 7290 BB ;each change to the plan creates a work order. It took a week for the back log of work orders to process or cancel out each other and then after that cleared I was able to put her on a data only plan. She was very frustrated to say the least. It took me another 3 days to get her device actually configured cirrectly because tire 2 techs has messed with all of the settings trying to get her device to work because they did not have any training in the billing system that had the back log of work orders. >> You may be right. I no longer see Unlimited Media Net as an availible >> option for my particular existing account. [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > their > level of usage was going to be. No the data usage doesn't raise a flag! unlimited is unlimited! a long as you you the wap and not the isp portal. There is no way t tell if your viewing on your phone or a laptop or whatever, the info i still being accessed by your phone. cingular even has instructions fo tethering on the dern web page. Your data usage would not be differen tethered or not. it's not like it increases your speed or anything. Nor does it allow you to access html info instead of wap. There is n difference except having a bigger screen to view it on. nokia 6200? All I could find was a nokia 6230 http://tinyurl.com/9kzn4 Alcoholic Wrote: > You need to have the Pay per use removed from your acct because th > billing [quoted text clipped - 91 lines] > > --- > > Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley (Lake County) CA USA 38.8,-122.5 Signaturetroyboy30 >No the data usage doesn't raise a flag! unlimited is unlimited! as >long as you you the wap and not the isp portal. There is no way to [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >Nor does it allow you to access html info instead of wap. There is no >difference except having a bigger screen to view it on. Essentially correct, although there are some TCP/IP services (e.g., types of VPN) that work over "ISP" (Data Connect) but not "WAP" (MEdia Net). SignatureBest regards, HELP FOR CINGULAR GSM & SONY ERICSSON PHONES: John Navas <http://navasgrp.home.att.net/#Cingular> > Essentially correct, although there are some TCP/IP services (e.g., types of > VPN) that work over "ISP" (Data Connect) but not "WAP" (MEdia Net). I have run Nortel Contivity VPN for hours at a time on the WAP connection. The connection is stable on my V551-Bluetooth. Signature--- Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley (Lake County) CA USA 38.8,-122.5 >> Essentially correct, although there are some TCP/IP services (e.g., types of >> VPN) that work over "ISP" (Data Connect) but not "WAP" (MEdia Net). > >I have run Nortel Contivity VPN for hours at a time on the WAP connection. >The connection is stable on my V551-Bluetooth. I said "some" -- as in some will work and some will not. I likewise have had success with some VPN (e.g., SSH), but failure with others. SignatureBest regards, HELP FOR CINGULAR GSM & SONY ERICSSON PHONES: John Navas <http://navasgrp.home.att.net/#Cingular> >You need to have the Pay per use removed from your acct because the billing >system will allow the feature to take precedence over the Works pkg or any >other data plan that you have. Pay As You Go (data) is only invoked when some other data package isn't on the account. It only needs to be removed if you don't want any data at all. >My understanding is that if you tether to a >Laptop you have to have a Data Connect plan not a media net acct. MEdia Net works fine with a tethered laptop. It's just not supported. >I used to >have a P900 and used the old Media Works pkg 19.99 unlmtd data but after Likewise with a P800. I still have that data package, using it now with both my Motorola V551 and Sony Ericsson GC82 PC Card. >checking with a tech supervisor I was told that it was against policy and >needed to be under a PDA plan. If I used the blue tooth or data connect >cable to tether to my laptop I was told that I have to use a Data connect >plan. It's against policy for reps to knowingly sell you that kind of usage since it's not supported -- you're strictly on your own -- but there is no actual prohibition in the Service Agreement against that kind of usage. >I know a lot of people that are on the old unlmtd works pkg and using >it to tether to a laptop and are getting away with it I'm one of them. >but it does " the data >usage" raise a red flag with revenue assurance and they will catch it >eventually. I've been doing this without any complaint or objection from Cingular, even with months of heavy usage, ever since the data package was first offered. Again, there is no actual prohibition in the Service Agreement against that kind of usage. >Cingular is scraping the bottom of the barrel for cash. Where do you get that? Cingular is actually doing quite well. >The data >plans are much more expensive than the works or basic pkg but if you use a >laptop my guess is your usage is around 80 to 130 MB per month ; I was using >about 42 mb with my P900 with Opera browser. I've hit hundreds of MB per month. Last month was "only" 164 MB. >Data packaging is very >confusing with Cingular and most if not all reps have had no training on the >differences. ... I personally think it's pretty clear... MEdia Net: https://www.cingular.com/media/media_net_purchase Data Connect: http://www.cingular.com/sbusiness/data_connect SignatureBest regards, HELP FOR CINGULAR GSM & SONY ERICSSON PHONES: John Navas <http://navasgrp.home.att.net/#Cingular> > MEdia Net works fine with a tethered laptop. It's just not supported. I've been using it for the past month, based in part on your advice. In my experience, it works, but poorly. Typically, I get a disconnect within five minutes or so of connecting. That seems to be true both for using it in a moving car--what I am doing at the moment--and in a fixed location. Can anyone offer guesses on what I'm doing wrong? I'm using a Mac Powerbook, a Nokia 6230, and my settings are: Configure IPv4 using PPP Service Provider: Cingular Wireless Internet Express Account: WAP@CINGULARGPRS.COM Password: (Can't read it--I think Cingular1, and it appears to work) Telephone number: wap.cingular No PPP echo packets No TCP header compression Error correction and compression in modem enabled Modem: Nokia 3G C1D1 I've tried varying the modem and some of the other settings, including "Cingular MEdia" as the Service Provider, but nothing seems to work any better. Suggestions? SignatureRemove NOSPAM to email Also remove .invalid www.daviddfriedman.com >> MEdia Net works fine with a tethered laptop. It's just not supported. > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >using it in a moving car--what I am doing at the moment--and in a fixed >location. You're pushing the envelope to keep a GPRS connection in a moving car, since any7 loss of signal will break the connection. That said, I have kept some long connections while in a moving car. OTOH, you should have no problem maintaining a connection while motionless (given a decent signal) -- I've maintained connections for hours. >Can anyone offer guesses on what I'm doing wrong? I'm using a Mac >Powerbook, a Nokia 6230, and my settings are: [SNIP] Perhaps your Mac software is hanging up the connection. Can the phone maintain a long connection on its own? SignatureBest regards, HELP FOR CINGULAR GSM & SONY ERICSSON PHONES: John Navas <http://navasgrp.home.att.net/#Cingular> >I've hit hundreds of MB per month. Last month was "only" 164 MB. Anyone tried taking a few hundred mile drive and matching what you see out the window with a simultaneous running of Google Earth? > The specific language often used by CS is something like "tethered use > is not supported..." This means they won't help you with it, not that > it doesn't work. It also probably means that there's no promise it'll > continue to work as it does today. The language today is "we don't allow you to tether with the MediaNet or Media* bundles. You would need PDA Connect or Laptop Connect". Also, my combination of Media Basic and MediaNet-1MB (unlimited for one month) is not an allowed combination, so they canceled the MediaNet, and didn't tell me. The overages caught my eye on the bill ;-) At first, he just said I couldn't have both packages, then he said that I did show 1MB with the MEdiaBasic, and 1MB with the MediaNet package on my bill. I pointed out that if I had 2MB, I had unlimited, according to the web page. The data charge was reversed. I left it at MediaWorks, which gives me way too many messages, and 5MB of data. The comment about tethering was almost a casual toss-off, probably because I used so much data. I'll just have to stop surfing the web on my phone so much. Most of the data is trying to load web pages that won't load anyway. Signature--- Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley (Lake County) CA USA 38.8,-122.5 >> > Since my "Media Net Pay Per Use" plan apparently only allows the phone >> > (WAP.CINGULAR.COM), but not a tethered computer (ISP.CINGULAR.COM), access [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >something, I was indeed able to check email, google, etc. So it appears >to me that WAP and ISP are very different things. No? Different, yes, but WAP works fine for email, Google, etc. SignatureBest regards, HELP FOR CINGULAR GSM & SONY ERICSSON PHONES: John Navas <http://navasgrp.home.att.net/#Cingular> |
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