Cingular helping California's financial crisis?

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jer - 10 Sep 2003 04:55 GMT

Everybody's seen this already, right?

http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascity/business/6731420.htm

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jer email reply - I am not a 'ten' ICQ = 35253273
"All that we do is touched with ocean, yet we remain on the shore of
what we know." -- Richard Wilbur

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Cell Academician - 10 Sep 2003 19:41 GMT

jer <gdunn@airmail.ten> wrote in article
<bjm78v$gii@library2.airnews.net>:

> Everybody's seen this already, right?
>
> http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascity/business/6731420.htm

$12 million won't make a dent in the financial crisis, plus
Cingular is appealing. It could drag on for years before a
settlement is reached.

The best thing for Cingular to do would be to admit the
mistake, pay the money and move on. Even they don't
deny that the problems that led to the fine were real.
UCAN (a California consumer group) was pushing for
an $100 million dollar fine.

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J - 10 Sep 2003 22:33 GMT

This is the same state that declared that the Boy Scouts is a
religious organization, that legalizes illegal immigration, that hold
special interest above the residents..that tried to make "In God we
trust" illegal ( and the list goes on) .yea, great legal decisions

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Steven M. Scharf - 11 Sep 2003 06:11 GMT

> This is the same state that declared that the Boy Scouts is a
> religious organization.

The boy scouts wanted to kick out a scout because he did not believe in god.
You can't get much more religious than that! It's fine if the boy scouts
want
to limit their membership to religious people. Just don't ask for any state
sponsorship or money for an organization that discriminates based on
religion.

> that legalizes illegal immigration,

Immigration is a federal matter. What California is trying to do is to make
the best of a bad situation caused by large agribusinesse's successful
efforts to ensure that the federal government does not jeopardize their
main source of cheap labor. The solution is a guest worker program,
but agribusiness doesn't want this because it would result in better
wages.

Look at the big picture: California is not allowed to deport illegals; it's
not under their jurisdiction. Is it better to deny them medical care and
schooling and have diseased people picking vegetables and working
in restaurants, with their kids hanging around getting into trouble? Is it
better to have them take driving tests and get insurance than have them
driving without licenses and insurance? They WILL drive, no matter
what)?

The backers of proposition 187 knew that it was unconstitutional
and would never be implemented. They wanted to do two things,
1) make a statement about how much illegal immigration was costing
the state (very debatable as to whether it's negative or positive),
and 2) create a wedge between Caucasion and Latino voters, and
get more conservatives to the polls to re-elect Pete Wilson. It worked.

> that hold special interest above the residents.

Can't argue with that one.

>that tried to make "In God we trust" illegal ( and the list goes on) .

Technically it should be illegal since it violates the U.S. constitution.

You should read Al Franken's book, _Lies and the Lying Liars Who Tell Them_.

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J - 12 Sep 2003 14:54 GMT

Al Frankin is an idiot, plain and simple. The US was founded on the
principles of God, that is fact! The phrase "In God we trust" is NOT
in any way a violation of church and state, that also is fact. Read
the constitution and the amendments..and stop listening to those who
don't have a clue.
As for immigration, arrest those who hire them as well as the
immigrants. Send all those illegalls to the state departments front
door, and drop the problem on them. (unless everyone just would rather
ignore the law) Illegals do not pay taxes, they should not get the
priviliges that go with paying them. I guess you would rather pay for
their support through your taxes and let them have a free ride. Most
people in this country work within the law, not outside of it.
Stop giving the Dept of Immigration a free pass to ignore the
problem. As far as cheap labor, your right, the cost of goods would go
up if we had to pay a far wage to legal citizen, but "dare I say" that
would lower the unemployment rate. Balboa park was originally donated
to the Boy scouts for the Boy Scouts, as stated in the original
agreement with the city. The discrimination against atheism is because
a belief in God is a tenant of being a scout. "Duty to God and
Country" is their message. They don't care what religion you are,
just that you believe in God. The fanatical left has filled
californians head's with so many lies and disinformation the people no
longer know what to believe and can't tell truth from fiction.
Now, if your against God, if your against the security of the country,
if your against fair employment for our citizens, then by all means,
keep going in the direction your headed. If you want solid decent
morals for our children, free thought, good employment and health care
for all, then doing something positive and stop listening to liberals
of the left.

>> This is the same state that declared that the Boy Scouts is a
>> religious organization.
[quoted text clipped - 39 lines]
>
>You should read Al Franken's book, _Lies and the Lying Liars Who Tell Them_.

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Cell Academician - 12 Sep 2003 17:56 GMT

J <none@hotmail.com> wrote in article
<fui3mvcqlsm1spsoneit6ecavp58cu2njn@4ax.com>:

> Al Frankin is an idiot, plain and simple.

Surely you can do better than that. What's great about
Al Franken's book is that in one place it documents all
the lies coming from the far right media. Until then, I found
it amusing to leaf through the books by Coulter and Hannity
and pick out all the most obvious lies. Two nut cases, and
the sad thing is that there are so many uneducated people
that take their lies as gospel and never do any research
themselves.

>The US was founded on the
> principles of God, that is fact!

And the founders were wise enough to write into the
constitution the separation of church and state because
they personally had experienced what happens when the
state becomes involved in religion. All it will take is for
a pagan student organization to demand the use of school
facilities, for all the right wing wackos to suddenly discover
that the constitution doesn't allow religion in public schools.

>As for immigration, arrest those who hire them as well as
>the immigrants.

I agree with this, but the state cannot arrest them.
Immigration is a federal issue. The federal government
has no interest in offending the special interests that benefit
from illegal immigration.

> Send all those illegalls to the state departments front
> door, and drop the problem on them. (unless everyone
> just would rather ignore the law)

Unfortunately, the state does not have the power to round
up illegals and send them to Washington D.C..

>Illegals do not pay taxes,

Illegals have Federal income tax, state income tax,
Social Security taxes and medicare taxes withheld
by their employers. Even though they don't earn enough
to actually owe any income taxes they do not file a return
and hence do not get a refund of their unowed taxes.
They also pay sales taxes of course.

>they should not get the priviliges that go with paying
>them. I guess you would rather pay for their support
> through your taxes and let them have a free ride.

Personally I think that they should be deported. Wages
for the jobs they do will rise and will attract non-illegals.
The costs of goods and services they provide will rise, but
I'm perfectly willing to pay more for produce and
restaurant meals and for manual labor.

However as long as the Republicans don't want to do anything
about illegal immigration, for fear of offending their
special interest constituents, it behooves everyone that
the illegals are not spreading disease, driving without
licenses, or having their kids running around the streets
instead of being in school. It infuriates me that my taxes are
going to pay for health care and schooling for people that
are not here legally, but I know that since the state can't
deport these people, that the alternative is even worse.

> The discrimination against atheism is because
> a belief in God is a tenant of being a scout.
> "Duty to God and Country" is their message.

It's a fine message. But it discriminates on the basis
of religion.

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little John - 12 Sep 2003 20:22 GMT

> J <none@hotmail.com> wrote in article
> <fui3mvcqlsm1spsoneit6ecavp58cu2njn@4ax.com>:
[quoted text clipped - 72 lines]
>
> [posted via phonescoop.com]

And just what has all this got to do with Cingular?

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Ryan Baiad - 17 Sep 2003 03:50 GMT

> never do any research

Maybe you should try this sometime.

> And the founders were wise enough to write into the
> constitution the separation of church and state because
> they personally had experienced what happens when the
> state becomes involved in religion.

Can you show me where that is in the constitution? I've never read that.

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William Bray - 11 Sep 2003 06:15 GMT

My apologies. I posted in haste and did not notice that you had already
posted this message. This is a great article.

jer <gdunn@airmail.ten> wrote in article
<bjm78v$gii@library2.airnews.net>:

> Everybody's seen this already, right?
>
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> "All that we do is touched with ocean, yet we remain on the shore of
> what we know." -- Richard Wilbur

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