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Cellular Phone Forum / Providers / Cingular / February 2006

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Cingular withdrawing the Sony/Ericsson z520a ???

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Steven M. Haflich - 16 Jan 2006 02:21 GMT
I'm curious if anyone else has beard new of this:
[Long story.]

Just one week ago I purchased a new Cingular family plan in
Northern CA including two z520a phones (and one unrelated
model).  The phones have mostly worked, but twice mine has
locked up in a weird way.  The first time I didn't investigate
carefully (since I had been experimenting with bluetooth with my PC)
but today it happened again and I took the time to make a techno-
dweebhead analysis.  (I was at the time coping with two emergencies,
both of which needed phone communications, and I was hiking in the
hills with no landlines close by.)

The symptom is that although the phone is set to vibrate _and_ ring,
the phone only vibrates for incoming calls.  (This caused me to miss
a couple calls during the emergencies.)  After establishing that the
phone was still set to ring, I tried to play the file currently set as
the ring tone, a midi file.  The phone responded that the file could
not be played, with no further explanation, and similarly for several
other files, including the annoying, undeletable tasteless technopop
music files files the programmers of this phone thought reasonable to
force a classical musician to carry around in his pocket.

I decided the phone's OS had wedged itself, so powered off to reboot
it.  The phone absolutely refused to power back on.  Urgently needing
the phone, I was finally able to reset it by removing the battery for
30 seconds and then restarting.

So, later today (a Sunday of a holiday weekend) I returned to the
Cingular company store and sales agent that sold me the phone.  He
said that just that morning Cingular had withdrawn the z520a because
the phone was defective.  Indeed, the phone had been removed from the
wall display.  Unfortunately, since the change was so recent, he did
not know what Cingular would do to replace the phone it its lineup.
Another employee thought they would reissue it (presumably the problem
is programming, so existing units could be reflashed) but the only
thing he could do immediately was to offer me an exchange to a
different model of phone.  I declined, wanting to review the
possibilities before acting.

Later I tried Cingular customer service at 611.  The support person
(who genuinely seemed to be sited in the USA_ denied that there was
any news on the z520a.  I suggested that he might not have received the
news yet, since it was very recent, but he denied this with a rather
surly tone, and recited about three times all my options to exchange
the phone for the same model, or another model.  He refused my request
to have Cingular contact me in a few days after the matter could be
researched, so I told him to log the problem and that _I_ would contact
them again in a few days.

Later in the day I checked the Cingular web site, specifically, the
selection of offered phones.  The z520a is no longer listed.

So I'm eager to learn any breaking news on the z520a at Cingular.
Meanwhile, the possibility grows that I will return to my previous
carrier.
Jer - 16 Jan 2006 02:30 GMT
> I'm curious if anyone else has beard new of this:
> [Long story.]
[quoted text clipped - 52 lines]
> Meanwhile, the possibility grows that I will return to my previous
> carrier.

Two people have offered you an exchange for a different model.  What are
you waiting for?

Signature

jer
email reply - I am not a 'ten'

Steven M. Haflich - 16 Jan 2006 03:08 GMT
> Two people have offered you an exchange for a different model.  What are
> you waiting for?

First, thanks for the confirmation.  I'm a little curious from where you
got your information, and when.

I certainly shall exchange the phone (unless I dump Cingular completely)
but I was in no rush to pick a different phone before studying the options
and the independent reviews.  Cingular doesn't have a plethora of clamshell
phones that include camera and bluetooth, but I've got a couple weeks to
decide.  (Suggestions welcome.)  Meanwhile, what I suspect will happen is
that Cingular will correct the way they've botched the z520a programming,
or ese Sony/Ericsson will correct the way _they_ botched it, and the phone
will be reissued.  But it would have to be soon to help me.
Cliff - 16 Jan 2006 03:36 GMT
> > Two people have offered you an exchange for a different model.  What are
> > you waiting for?
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> or ese Sony/Ericsson will correct the way _they_ botched it, and the phone
> will be reissued.  But it would have to be soon to help me.

Unless I am mistaken here - Cingular only resells the phones and does not
program the phone - so it sounds like there is a "Botch" on the part of S.E.
Steven M. Haflich - 16 Jan 2006 04:20 GMT
>> Meanwhile, what I suspect will happen is
>>that Cingular will correct the way they've botched the z520a programming,
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> Unless I am mistaken here - Cingular only resells the phones and does not
> program the phone - so it sounds like there is a "Botch" on the part of S.E.

This is unclear to me.  Certainly the bulk of the programming is done by the
manufacturer, but at least a little customization is done by the network
provider.  For example, the phone has apparently-hardwired startup and
shutdown Cingular graphics, hardwired Cingular menu items, and a few
ringtones and backgrounds are Cingular specific in addition to one or two
S.E. specific logos.  I presume these are prvided by Cingular's custom
flash (just as Verizon hamstrings bluetooth in their custom flash for other
phones) but I don't know for sure that this is the mechanism by which these
evil deeds are accomplished.

So I am still assuming that the programming fault, assuming it is a
programming fault and not a hardware fault, could be blamed on either side.
But I'm willing to be educated.
Jer - 16 Jan 2006 06:20 GMT
>>> Meanwhile, what I suspect will happen is
>>> that Cingular will correct the way they've botched the z520a
[quoted text clipped - 21 lines]
> programming fault and not a hardware fault, could be blamed on either side.
> But I'm willing to be educated.

Here's what I've heard on the street... Cingular will obtain a few
(~50-75)units for testing, some in the lab, some in the field.  These
lab rats will have their programming changed by Cingular engineers many
times before any opinion of their performance is settled.  Whatever
opinion Cingular ends up with, if the model is accepted, will be sent
back to the manufacturing line, where the customized firmware and seem
files are included in future retail units before being shipped to
Cingular.  So, although Cingular doesn't actually program every unit on
their shelves themselves, specialized programming is dictated by
Cingular and applied by the manufacturer in mass quantities for retail
sale.  Once these customized units arrive at Cingular's warehouse, the
only thing remaining is to shove a SIM in and out the door it goes.
This all sounds plausible to me.

Signature

jer
email reply - I am not a 'ten'

Steven E. Harris - 16 Jan 2006 16:23 GMT
> Cingular doesn't have a plethora of clamshell phones that include
> camera and bluetooth, but I've got a couple weeks to decide.
> (Suggestions welcome.)

It took me a few months to finally settle on the SE z520a. In fact, I
just ordered it last Friday (13 January) and haven't even received it
yet. Now I'm not sure how to proceed.

Signature

Steven E. Harris

Chris Sweeney - 19 Jan 2006 04:18 GMT
I have the z520a and as a matter of fact have never had problems with it
yet...knock on wood.  However it is confirmed there is a problem with
memory leakage in the software.  If you ordered it on Friday chances are
your order will be delayed for an updated model as the recall was placed
on Monday.  New z520a's are expected early Feb in the field.

>>Cingular doesn't have a plethora of clamshell phones that include
>>camera and bluetooth, but I've got a couple weeks to decide.
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> just ordered it last Friday (13 January) and haven't even received it
> yet. Now I'm not sure how to proceed.
Lord Vader - 20 Jan 2006 21:23 GMT
Other known/ recognized software issues with the SE z520a:

Blank Displays/Screens
Frozen Animations
Menu icons looking strange
Ringtones not playing on incoming calls

A power cycle is a temporary fix until the corrected handsets are
available for warranty exchange. ETA still stands as 1/23/2006.

Signature

Lord Vader

Chris Sweeney - 19 Jan 2006 04:13 GMT
The phones are being reflashed and will be available again in Feb 06.
Yes there is a software bug in them where like previous versions of
windows they eat up all the memory until you power cycle them.  If you
really want to keep the phone the best way to get arround the problem is
to "reboot" power cycle the phone every day.

>> Two people have offered you an exchange for a different model.  What
>> are you waiting for?
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> or ese Sony/Ericsson will correct the way _they_ botched it, and the phone
> will be reissued.  But it would have to be soon to help me.
Michael3977 - 16 Jan 2006 13:10 GMT
Took them over a year to pull the Moto V600,  and than replace them
with a V551, for customers that complained enough
SMS - 16 Jan 2006 19:19 GMT
> I'm curious if anyone else has beard new of this:
> [Long story.]
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
> both of which needed phone communications, and I was hiking in the
> hills with no landlines close by.)

First of all, avoid SE phones like the plague.

Second, I go hiking a lot in Northern California (Marin, Santa Cruz
Mountains, East Bay, Peninsula, all the way down to the Pinnacles) and
Cingular is a poor choice if you expect to get decent coverage. I've
tried GSM phones while hiking (still have one that uses Cingular's
network), but a Verizon CDMA/AMPS phone (tri-mode) has far, far, better
coverage. In many areas where you're likely to be hiking there is _only_
AMPS coverage.

If it's not too late, drop Cingular and move to Verizon or Sprint, and
be certain to choose tri-mode phones. Yes, Verizon is more expensive,
but for the best coverage, you have no choice. One thing to be careful
about is that when tri-mode phones switch to AMPS, the battery life is
very short, just a few hours of standby. I switch my phone off while
hiking, unless I'm expecting a call, and just turn it on to make calls.

Another alternative is to get a prepaid TDMA/AMPS phone for use while
hiking, and keep the Cingular phone for regular use. These TDMA/AMPS
phones will work for another two years or so, then the TDMA network will
be gone.
m.vassmer@insightbb.com - 18 Jan 2006 02:17 GMT
I've had the same problem with ringtones you describe.  According to
the Cingular customer forums, some customers are hearing that a
shipment of fixed phones is coming out between 1/23 and 1/28.  This
date will not be confirmed online by the Cingular rep, but he
acknowledges that something is in the works.  I've already exchanged
the phone once and the replacement phone has the same issue with
non-playing ringtones.  I am waiting until the end of this month, then
I'm going to push them to exchange it for a "fixed" Z520a phone. (My
wife's too  - as she has the same model with the same issues, though
she hasn't replaced hers yet.)  If that does not fix it, I'll push for
a different brand of cell phone from the warranty department.  I'm 30
days out, so I need to go the warranty route.  If I was within 30 days,
I'd switch for a different model now.
Steven M. Haflich - 18 Jan 2006 20:40 GMT
> I've had the same problem with ringtones you describe.  According to
> the Cingular customer forums, some customers are hearing that a
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> days out, so I need to go the warranty route.  If I was within 30 days,
> I'd switch for a different model now.

This is good news!  I think I will plan to do the same as you, and it's
somewhat easier for me because I have several weeks remaining before
my 30 day trial expires.  I'll ping Cingular support every few days.
If anyone hears any news, please post.
Steven E. Harris - 18 Jan 2006 20:53 GMT
> If anyone hears any news, please post.

I did talk with a Cingular CSR this morning who confirmed that the
"fixed" stock should start arriving on January 23. She advised that I
hold off on my exchange request until then. (I too am well within the
30-day horizon for now.)

Signature

Steven E. Harris

Racquet - 25 Jan 2006 02:12 GMT
This was posted in the Cingular customer forum on 1/20/2006. I am on
hold now (25 minutes) with Cingular trying to get my 2 replacements.

"Once again, we are pleased to say that because of all your posts and
others stating their issue, Sony Ericsson has found the cause of many
of your concerns.

Under certain situations and when you're not turning your devices on
and off as part of their regular usage, customers are experiencing
issues with their Z520a's (i.e., frozen animations, blank screens,
top menu icon corruption and ring tones that don't play for incoming
calls, etc.).  The root cause of this issue has been determined by Sony
Ericsson to be a memory leak on the device.  The device is currently
not releasing memory as it should when it attempts to move from one
cell site to another.  This issue is not occurring in all areas as well
as not in all the models sold, and can be resolved by simply power
cycling the device.  The issue will reappear every 3-4 days assuming
the customer does not power cycle the device on a regular basis.  This
is very similar to an experience you would have on your desktop when
you are notified that you no longer have memory available to complete
the task and you are asked to reboot your PC.

Any exchanges to the new batch of Z520a will not be available until
after January 23, 2006 (tentative date) when Cingular Wireless receives
the new shipment of these devices without the above said issue.

Exchange Information:

New devices (within 30 days):  Return to your POINT OF SALE for
exchange options.

New or refurbished (over 30 days but less than one year ago): Call
Customer Care for options of Exchange by Mail.

Anything other then what was stated here must be directed to Customer
Care, thank you for all your input.  Thank you for your comments,
opinions to this topic. It appears that we have provided you with
useful answers. This issue has been thoroughly discussed and is now
closed.  Should you find something NEW that we have not already
discussed in this thread - feel free to open another thread to shed
light of your issue or concern.  If Cingular Wireless has new
developments with this Z520a as always, we will alert our boards.
Thanks for joining our online community.
Message Edited by G8Keeper on 01-20-2006 02:41 PM "
Racquet - 25 Jan 2006 02:29 GMT
The new batch of phones is not arriving on 1/27/2006 according to
Cigular Warranty Service.
Wirelessjuan - 25 Jan 2006 02:40 GMT
See if they will give you the Motorola V557 instead.  While it doesn't
have the PICTURE calleri ID on the outside of the phone it is a nicer
phone with the same features.
xxxxxxxx - 02 Feb 2006 04:29 GMT
>See if they will give you the Motorola V557 instead.  While it doesn't
>have the PICTURE calleri ID on the outside of the phone it is a nicer
>phone with the same features.

The V557 also has a bigger screen.  Unfortunately, it has less than a
third of the memory of a z520a, and no infrared.
John Navas - 02 Feb 2006 16:19 GMT
>>See if they will give you the Motorola V557 instead.  While it doesn't
>>have the PICTURE calleri ID on the outside of the phone it is a nicer
>>phone with the same features.
>
>The V557 also has a bigger screen.  Unfortunately, it has less than a
>third of the memory of a z520a, and no infrared.

OTOH, it has EDGE, and is thus considerably faster for data.

The next step up from the V557 is the V360:

* Lighter
* Internal antenna
* Double the talk time
* Improved internal color display
* Larger external display
* TransFlash / microSD memory expansion [up tp 256 MB]
* EGPRS (EDGE) Class 10 [faster]
* Push To Talk
* MP3 player
* Extended voice dictation

Drawback:

* Tri-band (850/1800/1900 or 900/1800/1900) rather than quad-band

Signature

Best regards,        SEE THE FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS AT
John Navas          <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>

Lord Vader - 02 Feb 2006 19:23 GMT
Wirelessjuan Wrote:
> See if they will give you the Motorola V557 instead.  While it doesn't
> have the PICTURE calleri ID on the outside of the phone it is a nicer
> phone with the same features.

Unfortuantely at this time cingular XBM only has seesdtock v557, so
swap from another make/model for the v557 is not possible. :-
Wirelessjuan - 02 Feb 2006 21:33 GMT
It looks like the z520a reflashed equipment has been redeployed at this
point so you might be able to get an updated z520a
Racquet - 03 Feb 2006 04:20 GMT
I just received my reflashed Z520a in the mail.
 
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