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Cellular Phone Forum / Providers / Cingular / October 2006

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Did I Just Get f.cked?

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Scott en Aztlán - 27 Oct 2006 03:24 GMT
I've been with Cingular for several years now. I have been
month-to-month since day one - one of the reasons I switched to
Cingular was because, unlike T-Mobile, they would let me sign up
without a long-term contract. Since then I have added two additional
lines to my Family Talk plan, and each time my account remained
month-to-month.

The other day I added another line. The clerk at the Cingular store
made no mention of any contract, and I assumed I would simply be
billed an additional $9.99/month for the additional line with no other
changes. Tonight I checked my account on the Cingular web site, and
there is a highly suspicious "24 months" in the "terms" field for the
new line (the original phones all say "0" in this field). Did I just
get f.cked into a 24-month contract?
Todd H. - 27 Oct 2006 04:08 GMT
> I've been with Cingular for several years now. I have been
> month-to-month since day one - one of the reasons I switched to
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> new line (the original phones all say "0" in this field). Did I just
> get f.cked into a 24-month contract?

Possibly.  

Did you sign a 24 month contract?  Did you accept discounted pricing
on a new phone?

--
Todd H.  
http://www.toddh.net/
Scott en Aztlán - 27 Oct 2006 04:48 GMT
>> Did I just get f.cked into a 24-month contract?
>
>Possibly.  
>
>Did you sign a 24 month contract?

AFAIK I didn't sign any contracts.

>Did you accept discounted pricing on a new phone?

I supplied a phone that I already own (and that I paid full price for
originaly). All the guy did was pop in a new SIM card and activate it.
Todd H. - 27 Oct 2006 05:06 GMT
> >> Did I just get f.cked into a 24-month contract?
> >
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> originaly). All the guy did was pop in a new SIM card and activate
> it.

If you supplied the phone, the sales rep f*cked up--no reason for a 2
year contract i nthat case.  I'd call Cingular, tell them what
happened and see if they'll update it in the billing system.  

It's possible you may have to go back to the store and have them
correct it there though, I'm not sure.

--
Todd H.  
http://www.toddh.net/
randy - 27 Oct 2006 06:20 GMT
You have 30 days to get out of what ever happened.

      Then try again, with eyes wide open!
randy

> I've been with Cingular for several years now. I have been
> month-to-month since day one - one of the reasons I switched to
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> new line (the original phones all say "0" in this field). Did I just
> get f.cked into a 24-month contract?
JDeats - 27 Oct 2006 20:18 GMT
Be careful with the 30 day return clause.... In the fine print they can
screw you over. For example if you recieved discounted hardware (a
phone or phones discounted as part of contract signing) there is
sometimes a condition that explicitly invlaidates the 30 day return...
I fell vicitim to this once with Verizon. Not only did I not get my
money back for the handsets, I was also billed for late charges for the
one week of service I had the phones activated. The total was over $500
dollars, the handsets being charged at $220 each (these were free on
contract singing, but when I decided to take advantage of the 30 day
return I broke the terms of agreement making the discount possible,
meaning I had to pay for the phones).

I was lied to by the sales clerk who told me on activation that there
would be no problem. I threatened legal action against Verizon and they
pointed me to the contract. They were right.

While I have not delt with Cingular on this issue, I would just say
buyer beware.

> You have 30 days to get out of what ever happened.
>
[quoted text clipped - 15 lines]
> > new line (the original phones all say "0" in this field). Did I just
> > get f.cked into a 24-month contract?
JDeats - 28 Oct 2006 01:14 GMT
Be careful with the 30 day return clause.... In the fine print they can
screw you over. For example if you recieved discounted hardware (a
phone or phones discounted as part of contract signing) there is
sometimes a condition that explicitly invlaidates the 30 day return...
I fell vicitim to this once with Verizon. Not only did I not get my
money back for the handsets, I was also billed for late charges for the
one week of service I had the phones activated. The total was over $500
dollars, the handsets being charged at $220 each (these were free on
contract singing, but when I decided to take advantage of the 30 day
return I broke the terms of agreement making the discount possible,
meaning I had to pay for the phones).

I was lied to by the sales clerk who told me on activation that there
would be no problem. I threatened legal action against Verizon and they
pointed me to the contract. They were right.

While I have not delt with Cingular on this issue, I would just say
buyer beware.

> You have 30 days to get out of what ever happened.
>
[quoted text clipped - 15 lines]
> > new line (the original phones all say "0" in this field). Did I just
> > get f.cked into a 24-month contract?
John Navas - 28 Oct 2006 17:01 GMT
>Be careful with the 30 day return clause.... In the fine print they can
>screw you over. For example if you recieved discounted hardware (a
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
>While I have not delt with Cingular on this issue, I would just say
>buyer beware.

It's not an issue in the case of Cingular.

Signature

Best regards,        FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
John Navas          <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>

Thomas T. Veldhouse - 30 Oct 2006 15:00 GMT
> Be careful with the 30 day return clause.... In the fine print they can
> screw you over. For example if you recieved discounted hardware (a
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> return I broke the terms of agreement making the discount possible,
> meaning I had to pay for the phones).

That is because there is a 30 day period you are allowed to change the plan.
There is only a 14 day period to return the phones.  That is clearly spelled
out and communicated just about everywhere I have looked.

Signature

Thomas T. Veldhouse
Key Fingerprint: D281 77A5 63EE 82C5 5E68  00E4 7868 0ADC 4EFB 39F0

B. Wright - 27 Oct 2006 07:05 GMT
Scott en Aztl?n <scottenaztlan@yahoo.com> wrote:
> I've been with Cingular for several years now. I have been
> month-to-month since day one - one of the reasons I switched to
> Cingular was because, unlike T-Mobile, they would let me sign up
> without a long-term contract. Since then I have added two additional
> lines to my Family Talk plan, and each time my account remained
> month-to-month.

> The other day I added another line. The clerk at the Cingular store
> made no mention of any contract, and I assumed I would simply be
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> new line (the original phones all say "0" in this field). Did I just
> get f.cked into a 24-month contract?

    Cingular does not do anything now without a contract, not even
for long standing AT&T customers who they try to force into changing
plans (they want a 2 year contract).  They used to allow you to activate
without a contract if you provided your own equipment.  I did this once
and it said "no contract" right on the paper, but they dicks tried to
charge me a $200 cancellation fee anyway later.  I argued with them for
hours, faxed the contract, and nothing was done.  The only resolution
came when I went into the store where I got it with contract in hand and
yelled at the manager.

    You got screwed into a two year contract I'm sure.  I don't know
if they have the same guarantee period where you can cancel without
penalty (14 or 30 days?) on adding lines to your existing plan, maybe.
I would find out ASAP then go in and get rid of the extra line before
you're stuck with it.  At they very least if you got suckered into a two
year contract they should give you the "free" phone anyone else would
have been given.  The guy probably even did you a "favor" and re-upped
all your lines of service in the family plan to new two year contracts,
you'd better check.

    Seems Cingular just doesn't get it these days.  Most carriers
seem to use the two year contract to try to make sure they recover the
costs on their subsidized phones.  Cingular seems to be using it any way
they can to trap even loyal long standing customers into their "service"
so once they realize what a crap company they are (or have become) they
can't leave so easily.
Jack Mac - 27 Oct 2006 13:32 GMT
>I've been with Cingular for several years now. I have been
>month-to-month since day one - one of the reasons I switched to
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
>new line (the original phones all say "0" in this field). Did I just
>get f.cked into a 24-month contract?

I don't know about your phone or contract but your choice of
Subject just put you in my Kill File.
Adios!
Jack Mac
Elmo P. Shagnasty - 27 Oct 2006 15:54 GMT
> I don't know about your phone or contract but your choice of
> Subject just put you in my Kill File.

Why do you feel it necessary to tell him, and the world, that you've put
him in your killfile?

Does that give you some sort of perverse pleasure?
Todd Allcock - 27 Oct 2006 16:54 GMT
> > I don't know about your phone or contract but your choice of
> > Subject just put you in my Kill File.
>
> Why do you feel it necessary to tell him, and the world, that you've put
> him in your killfile?

I suspect you get killfiled so often the subject makes you a bit touchy,
huh, Elmo?

> Does that give you some sort of perverse pleasure?

I think he was expressing hisdispleasure at the four-letter word in the
subject line, which, frankly, I agree was unnecessary.  It didn't stop me
from attempting to help the OP, but he (the OP) certainly could've got
his point across less colorfully in a public forum.

Signature

Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

John Navas - 27 Oct 2006 20:43 GMT
>> Does that give you some sort of perverse pleasure?
>
>I think he was expressing hisdispleasure at the four-letter word in the
>subject line, which, frankly, I agree was unnecessary.  It didn't stop me
>from attempting to help the OP, but he (the OP) certainly could've got
>his point across less colorfully in a public forum.

Not only would more appropriate language might not have discouraged some
people from assisting, but a more descriptive subject might well have
attracted more assistance; e.g., "Does adding line extend contract by 24
months?"

Signature

Best regards,        FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
John Navas          <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>

Scott en Aztlán - 28 Oct 2006 04:59 GMT
>>> Does that give you some sort of perverse pleasure?
>>
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
>attracted more assistance; e.g., "Does adding line extend contract by 24
>months?"

Look, guys, I'm sorry you were all so offended by my use of the
f-word, but let's be real: we're all adults here, we've all heard the
word before, it's not going to burn anyone's tender little ears. And
besides, I was annoyed, frustrated, and dismayed by the sheer
incompetence (and/or outright malice) of some of Cingular's employees.
Catharsis is a good thing, and I feel better after venting.

As for Jack's little drama queen announcement, I think everyone sees
that for precisely what it is. :)
Mary - 28 Oct 2006 14:23 GMT
>>>> Does that give you some sort of perverse pleasure?
>>>
[quoted text clipped - 17 lines]
>As for Jack's little drama queen announcement, I think everyone sees
>that for precisely what it is. :)

1) Not just men read these newsgroups.

2) Most people consider the group they are speaking too and adjust
their vocabulary accordingly. When I am in the locker room with the
girls after a round of golf you should hear what we say. When I am in
public I speak in a way that I hope will earn me the respect of those
around me.

3) You sir are an idiot.
Scott en Aztlán - 28 Oct 2006 18:30 GMT
>>As for Jack's little drama queen announcement, I think everyone sees
>>that for precisely what it is. :)
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
>
>3) You sir are an idiot.

LOL!!! Is that how you show respect?
Mary - 29 Oct 2006 12:45 GMT
>>>As for Jack's little drama queen announcement, I think everyone sees
>>>that for precisely what it is. :)
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
>
>LOL!!! Is that how you show respect?

I believe I showed you all the respect you are entitled to, and
probably a lot more.
Ben Skversky - 30 Oct 2006 02:22 GMT
Mary, you are 100% correct. The OP is a jerk.

>>>>> Does that give you some sort of perverse pleasure?
>>>>
[quoted text clipped - 28 lines]
>
> 3) You sir are an idiot.
Jack Mac - 28 Oct 2006 03:06 GMT
>> > I don't know about your phone or contract but your choice of
>> > Subject just put you in my Kill File.
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
>from attempting to help the OP, but he (the OP) certainly could've got
>his point across less colorfully in a public forum.

Just what did Elmo have to say? I think he's been in my kill file a long time.
I'm sure it was nothing constructive. I've never seen him really Help anyone.
Usually a bunch of meaningless words.
Jack Mac
John Navas - 27 Oct 2006 17:26 GMT
>> I don't know about your phone or contract but your choice of
>> Subject just put you in my Kill File.
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>
>Does that give you some sort of perverse pleasure?

Pot ... kettle ...

Signature

Best regards,
John Navas

"Usenet is like a herd of performing elephants with diarrhea - massive,
difficult to redirect, awe inspiring, entertaining, and a source of mind
boggling amounts of excrement when you least expect it." --Gene Spafford

Scott en Aztlán - 28 Oct 2006 04:52 GMT
>I don't know about your phone or contract but your choice of
>Subject just put you in my Kill File.

http://i1.tinypic.com/n3ook9.jpg
PC Medic - 27 Oct 2006 21:51 GMT
> I've been with Cingular for several years now. I have been
> month-to-month since day one - one of the reasons I switched to
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> new line (the original phones all say "0" in this field). Did I just
> get f.cked into a 24-month contract?

Not unless you signed up for one.

I would also point out that one of my added lines shows up online as an
entirely different plan, even though my monthly bill always includes it
correctly as an added line on my regular plan.
Tashfeen Bhimdi - 30 Oct 2006 05:28 GMT
>Not unless you signed up for one.
>
>I would also point out that one of my added lines shows up online as an
>entirely different plan, even though my monthly bill always includes it
>correctly as an added line on my regular plan.

I added another line to my parent's account a few weeks ago.  I
brought in a phone myself, just wanted a new sim/number and for the
rep to tag on the 9.99 per month to their family plan already.  Well I
asked about the no contract thing since I had my own equipment, but
she said 2 year contracts only, even if there are no discounts.  Well
that was no good, in the end she ended up calling Cingular cust
service and adding the line so I could get a 1 year contract.  So in
the end the 4 line family plan has 3 lines ending a few months from
now and the new 4th line ending in a year.

Contract for a sim...what a pain.

Signature

Tashfeen Bhimdi

Scott en Aztlán - 28 Oct 2006 04:27 GMT
>I've been with Cingular for several years now. I have been
>month-to-month since day one - one of the reasons I switched to
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
>new line (the original phones all say "0" in this field). Did I just
>get f.cked into a 24-month contract?

Follow-up: I called Cingular customer service today, and found out
that yes, the clerk at the Cingular store did, in fact, flag my
account as having a 24-month "commitment." According to the CSR, the
clerk originally added my new line correctly (i.e. with no contract),
but for some unknown reason he made a phone call to customer service
on the following day and told them he had "mistakenly" signed me up
without a contract and asked them to change it! Whiskey. Tango.
Foxtrot. Over.

Somehow the rep was able to "pull up the original paperwork from the
store" and saw very clearly that there was NOT supposed to be a
contract, so she removed the contract from my account. I asked what I
could have done differently to avoid the hassle of spending 23 minutes
on the phone with a CSR to correct this kind of "mistake" and she had
no answer. I guess there's no defense against either incompetence or
outright malice on the part of the Cingular store clerks except to
remain vigilant and question things that don't look right.

So now the line shows up in my account with "11 months" in the "terms"
field instead of "24 months" like it said yesterday. When I asked why
all my other phones show "0 months" in this field I was given a lame
explanation which basically told me she had no clue why it shows up as
11 months on the web site - she swore up and down that it shows as "no
contract" on her screen. This left me a little uneasy, but I let it go
for the moment. It's not that I don't trust these people, but... ;)

So I guess the moral of this little story is to carefully check your
account after you make any changes, because the clerks at the stores
can and do make detrimental changes to your account behind your back.
Sad but true!

Thanks to everyone who replied.
Todd H. - 28 Oct 2006 06:04 GMT
> Somehow the rep was able to "pull up the original paperwork from the
> store"

I believe they scan em and have the imaging online for occasions like
this.

> and saw very clearly that there was NOT supposed to be a
> contract, so she removed the contract from my account. I asked what I
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> outright malice on the part of the Cingular store clerks except to
> remain vigilant and question things that don't look right.

The store clerks don't get paid much, and they're typically young and
typically idiots.  They may be used to have 2 year contracts with
people wanting new phones and just blaze through the screens. Or maybe
there's a commission for new contracts and they maliciously added it
in seeking the commission.  Hard to say, but screw ups from these
people are the rule rather than the exception it seems.  

> So I guess the moral of this little story is to carefully check your
> account after you make any changes, because the clerks at the stores
> can and do make detrimental changes to your account behind your back.
> Sad but true!

Thakns for following up--very informative.

By the way I had a similar story somewhat from a new line recently
added.  The fuggers added road side assistance to the line a month
after I signed up.  Or whatever useless add on they were pushing hard
that month at cingular.     It is lame you have to review these bills
like a friggin hawk especially when they're so damned complicated.

Best Regards,
--
Todd H.  
http://www.toddh.net/
Paul Goelz - 28 Oct 2006 13:35 GMT
>The store clerks don't get paid much, and they're typically young and
>typically idiots.  They may be used to have 2 year contracts with
>people wanting new phones and just blaze through the screens. Or maybe
>there's a commission for new contracts and they maliciously added it
>in seeking the commission.  Hard to say, but screw ups from these
>people are the rule rather than the exception it seems.  

The clerk in the store where I recently switched from TDMA to GSM was
neither young nor an idiot.  And she had a printout of the "must do"
goals for her store (Cingular owned) sitting there on the counter for
all to see.  She had a quota of a certain number of various types of
sales including upgrades and accessories added features.  Miss the
quota and it was supposedly curtains.  To her credit, she in no way
pressured me to do anything beyond the simple switch from TDMA to GSM.
But I also made it clear that was ALL I wanted to do.  

And yes I have had a bill since the swap and all is as expected ;)  

Paul
Scott en Aztlán - 28 Oct 2006 18:20 GMT
>The store clerks don't get paid much, and they're typically young and
>typically idiots.  They may be used to have 2 year contracts with
>people wanting new phones and just blaze through the screens.

That doesn't sound like what happened in this case. He did it
correctly on the day that I added the new line.

>Or maybe
>there's a commission for new contracts and they maliciously added it
>in seeking the commission.  

Now that I find very easy to believe. :-/

>By the way I had a similar story somewhat from a new line recently
>added.  The fuggers added road side assistance to the line a month
>after I signed up.  Or whatever useless add on they were pushing hard
>that month at cingular.     It is lame you have to review these bills
>like a friggin hawk especially when they're so damned complicated.

Speaking of that, I asked the CSR to drop the roadside assistance,
which had also been added onto my new line. I bet the store clerks get
a commission for the add-ons, as well. I hope they take the commission
back if the customer cancels - this clerk definitely doesn't deserve
that money.
John Navas - 30 Oct 2006 07:00 GMT
>The store clerks don't get paid much, and they're typically young and
>typically idiots.  They may be used to have 2 year contracts with
>people wanting new phones and just blaze through the screens. Or maybe
>there's a commission for new contracts and they maliciously added it
>in seeking the commission.  Hard to say, but screw ups from these
>people are the rule rather than the exception it seems.  

"Never attribute to malice that which can be
adequately explained by stupidity." [Hanlon's razor]

Signature

Best regards,        FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
John Navas          <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>

Elmo P. Shagnasty - 30 Oct 2006 11:34 GMT
> >The store clerks don't get paid much, and they're typically young and
> >typically idiots.  They may be used to have 2 year contracts with
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> "Never attribute to malice that which can be
> adequately explained by stupidity." [Hanlon's razor]

John doesn't get out much in the world.  Otherwise, he'd have heard
about this type of behavior long ago.

Oops--he has heard.  In this newsgroup.  But he refuses to acknowledge
it, because in his eyes Cingular can do no wrong, period.
Elmo P. Shagnasty - 28 Oct 2006 13:08 GMT
> Follow-up: I called Cingular customer service today, and found out
> that yes, the clerk at the Cingular store did, in fact, flag my
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> without a contract and asked them to change it! Whiskey. Tango.
> Foxtrot. Over.

WTF is that the store rep makes MONEY by signing you up for a contract.

The store rep had nothing to lose, and everything to gain, by this
malicious act.

Of course, maybe if you made enough of a stink, that rep would be fired.  
But what are the odds?  His manager makes money from that act, too.
Scott en Aztlán - 28 Oct 2006 18:27 GMT
>> Follow-up: I called Cingular customer service today, and found out
>> that yes, the clerk at the Cingular store did, in fact, flag my
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
>The store rep had nothing to lose, and everything to gain, by this
>malicious act.

And people wonder why I used the f-word when discussing this guy...

>Of course, maybe if you made enough of a stink, that rep would be fired.  
>But what are the odds?  His manager makes money from that act, too.

It wouldn't do any good to fire him. He'd just go across the street
and get a job at Verizon Wireless. :)
 
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