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Cellular Phone Forum / Providers / Cingular / March 2010

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News: Apple already considering iPad price reduction

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iPad: Read e and save a tree - 08 Feb 2010 22:40 GMT
WOW!
News: Apple already considering iPad price reductions?

Apple executives, speaking in a meeting with Credit Suisse analysts,
have suggested that the company is already considering price
reductions for its yet-to-be-released iPad tablet should early sales
of the device fail to live up to internal expectations. Citing Credit
Suisse analyst Bill Shope, the Wall Street Journal reports that Apple
wants the iPad to be the best device in several usage cases, including
consuming media and browsing the Internet.
--
My guess is a huge iPad back to School Sale in August.

Credit Suisse is the group that recently proclaimed, USA's biggest
cellular carrier, AT&T will continue with a USA Apple exclusive
locking Verizon out of any Apple relationship for 2010 and 2011.

That might be how we got unlimited no cap 3G data for only $30 on a
fabulous turn it on only when you need it AT&T data plan for the iPad.
iPad: Read e and save a tree - 08 Feb 2010 22:47 GMT
On Feb 8, 5:40 pm, "iPad: Read e and save a tree"
<vic.hea...@gmail.com> wrote:
> WOW!
> News: Apple already considering iPad price reductions?
[quoted text clipped - 15 lines]
> That might be how we got unlimited no cap 3G data for only $30 on a
> fabulous turn it on only when you need it AT&T data plan for the iPad.

Consumers lose interest in iPad after Apple's unveiling - survey

By Katie Marsal
Published: 10:15 AM EST

Despite a highly publicized public debut, potential customers lost a
great deal of interest in Apple's new touchscreen iPad after it was
unveiled, a new study has found.

A survey of more than 1,000 randomly selected customers at the online
marketplace Retrevo found that 52 percent of respondents have heard of
Apple's iPad, but are not interested in buying one. Another 18 percent
said they had not heard of the product, but also were not interested.

Prior to the product's unveiling, 26 percent of those surveyed had
heard of the then-mythical "Apple tablet," but were not interested in
buying one. That total doubled after the iPad's official Jan. 26
unveiling.

"It's the apps that sell smartphones like the iPhone and it could very
well be those same apps that motivate buyers to run down to the Apple
Store and get in line to buy a shiny new iPad," the company said.
"Whether this device becomes a big hit is anyone’s guess but based on
this study it sure looks doubtful."

The survey found that awareness of the iPad is high -- more than 80
percent of respondents said they had heard of Apple's product. Of
those, 21 percent said they need more information on the iPad before
they purchase, and 9 percent said they would likely buy one. The
company even tracked conversations on Twitter, and found the iPad
announcement rivaled talk of the U.S. presidential State of the Union
address, held the same day.

The survey results suggest consumers may not see how the iPad would
fit into their lives. While 5 percent said they "definitely" need one,
61 percent said they do not think they need an iPad.

In addition, the $130 premium cost to add 3G connectivity was found to
be a turn-off for potential buyers. While 12 percent would pay the
extra money for 3G and 29 percent would think about it, 59 percent of
respondents said they would not pay any extra for 3G.

Retrevo 1

Retrevo's latest survey was conducted between Jan. 27 and Feb. 3
following Apple's announcement of the iPad, starting at $499 and
scheduled to arrive in late March. The results were compared to a
previous study done between Jan. 16 and Jan. 20, before the iPad was
unveiled.

Retrevo 2

Last week, another study of medical professionals found that one in
five physicians said they are likely to purchase an iPad. Of more than
350 clinicians surveyed, 9 percent said they plan to buy the product
immediately, while another 13 percent intend to purchase one in the
first year.

Analysts mostly expect the iPad to have a moderate but successful
start, selling between one million and five million in its first year.
The product's aggressive $499 starting price is seen to be its
greatest asset. One analyst believes a sales "catalyst" must emerge --
as the iTunes Store did for the iPod, and App Store for the iPhone --
before the iPad sees significant growth.
Todd Allcock - 09 Feb 2010 06:12 GMT
> WOW!
> News: Apple already considering iPad price reductions?
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> reductions for its yet-to-be-released iPad tablet should early sales
> of the device fail to live up to internal expectations.

Why not?  That strategy worked wonders for the iPhone!  ;)
WindsorFox<[SS]> - 09 Feb 2010 13:42 GMT
> WOW!
> News: Apple already considering iPad price reductions?

    What do you mean already?  They were considering it in the
engineering phase, and the first reduction will come 6 months after it
goes on sale.

Signature

.

"A smorgasbord of tomfoolery"     -    L0afy

SMS - 10 Feb 2010 12:03 GMT
On Feb 8, 5:40 pm, "iPad: Read e and save a tree"
<vic.hea...@gmail.com> wrote:
> WOW!
> News: Apple already considering iPad price reductions?
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> wants the iPad to be the best device in several usage cases, including
> consuming media and browsing the Internet.

What you will likely see is a 64GB non-3G model at the $499 price
point. The $499 price point was great marketing, but as everyone
quickly realized a 64GB, 3G model, with the connectivity kit, is going
to cost nearly $1000. They really need only two models--with and
without 3G. With a lot of new tablets hitting the market, they have to
be very careful about pricing.

> Credit Suisse is the group that recently proclaimed, USA's biggest
> cellular carrier,

AT&T is not the USA's biggest cellular carrier, they are the 2nd
biggest.
No iPad 4U -  SOLD OUT! - 10 Feb 2010 13:55 GMT
> On Feb 8, 5:40 pm, "iPad: Read e and save a tree"
>
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
> without 3G. With a lot of new tablets hitting the market, they have to
> be very careful about pricing.

Well you might see this much later but for now they appear to already
sold out with the current pricing.
nospam - 10 Feb 2010 20:35 GMT
In article
<e00e4cf1-fe14-47c9-a21a-c1af6e0c518f@21g2000yqj.googlegroups.com>, No
iPad 4U -  SOLD OUT! <vic.healey@gmail.com> wrote:

> Well you might see this much later but for now they appear to already
> sold out with the current pricing.

it's not for sale yet.
Carl - 10 Feb 2010 21:00 GMT
> In article
> <e00e4cf1-fe14-47c9-a21a-c1af6e0c518f@21g2000yqj.googlegroups.com>, No
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
> it's not for sale yet.

Yeah, explain his post to me. It lost me entirely.
John Navas - 10 Feb 2010 14:42 GMT
>On Feb 8, 5:40 pm, "iPad: Read e and save a tree"
><vic.hea...@gmail.com> wrote:
[quoted text clipped - 15 lines]
>without 3G. With a lot of new tablets hitting the market, they have to
>be very careful about pricing.

Nonsense.  Apple has a standard practice of high pricing at launch,
harvesting iFans dumb enough to stand in line to pay full retail, later
dropping the price to whatever level is needed to keep demand high.

>> Credit Suisse is the group that recently proclaimed, USA's biggest
>> cellular carrier,
>
>AT&T is not the USA's biggest cellular carrier, they are the 2nd
>biggest.

More nonsense, not that it matters to anyone without your agenda.
It must really gall you that your all your iPhone forecasts have proven
to be dead wrong.

Signature

Best regards,
John           <http:/navasgroup.com>

If the iPhone is really so impressive,
why do iFans keep making excuses for it?

nospam - 10 Feb 2010 20:35 GMT
> Nonsense.  Apple has a standard practice of high pricing at launch,
> harvesting iFans dumb enough to stand in line to pay full retail, later
> dropping the price to whatever level is needed to keep demand high.

ignoring your pejorative jabs, that's normal for most companies and
actually apple doesn't do it anywhere near as much as you suggest.
Ness-Net - 12 Feb 2010 16:25 GMT
http://www.eweek.com/c/a/Mobile-and-Wireless/10-Things-Apple-Doesnt-Want-You-to-
Know-About-the-iPad-118317/?kc=EWKNLBOE02122010FEA1


Apple has been touting its iPad since it was first announced a few weeks ago. But after the hype wears off and we take an
honest look at the iPad, we quickly find that there are some major flaws with the company's tablet device that it just
doesn't want us to know about. When a consumer picks up the iPad expecting a top-of-the-line experience, they might be
surprised to learn that it can't quite provide that. They might be even more upset when they find out that the iPad isn't
as appealing as Steve Jobs wants the world to believe. So before you pick one up, let's take a look at what Apple doesn't
want you to know about the iPad.

Hobbled Web surfing
Although Steve Jobs didn't talk about it during his keynote, the device's browser doesn't support Flash. That omission
ensures that a large percentage of Websites won't work on the iPad. It also ensures that some elements of popular
Websites that don't entirely rely upon Flash won't work either. It's a major problem.

No multitasking
Those who are hoping to work in iWork and surf the Web at the same time will be disappointed with the iPad. Once again,
Steve Jobs failed to mention that, due to iPad software limitations, users won't be able to multitask. Being able to work
with multiple programs is not only a desired feature in today's tablet space, but it's quickly becoming a necessity.

Where's the video output?
Although the iPad will boast HD content through iTunes, a quick glance around the iPad reveals that there isn't a video
output slot, making it impossible for users to transfer video content to an HDTV or monitor. For now, it seems that the
iPad's video capabilities will rely only on iTunes.

Try printing
When a user receives an important e-mail on their Mac and decides to print it out, they simply click the "print" button
and do it. The iPad doesn't boast that luxury. Although Apple is marketing the iPad as the device that can bridge the gap
between the iPhone and the laptop, the company's tablet computer won't allow for printing to a connected device. It's a
major omission that could make some think twice about the iPad.

No DVD/Blu-ray drive
The iPad lacks an optical drive. Admittedly, the iPad is meant to be a mobile product that won't replace a computer. But
if Apple wants to market it as an entertainment product, wouldn't it make sense to make it easy for users to view or rip
movies and television shows on the device?

The $499 version is not a deal
Some point to the iPad's $499 price tag as a reason to pick up the device. Let's be honest, the $499 version lacks 3G and
it has the smallest available hard drive. The device's price tag is great for folks who want to only use the iPad at home
and won't add much content to it, but the iPad is meant to be a portable iPod Touch that can house entertainment content.
A 16GB hard drive with no 3G connectivity won't adequately deliver that experience.

Reading won't be fun
Since the iPad doesn't offer E-Ink technology or an OLED (Organic Light-Emitting Diod)] display, reading on its display
might be difficult for extended periods. It's another feature that Apple has glossed over. Yes, the iPad's technology
allows for viewing e-books in color, but E-Ink is so successful as an e-reader technology because it mimics a real book
and allows for longer reading periods without eye strain. The iPad will be like reading a book on a larger iPhone
display. That's probably not best for most readers.

Forget about USB
Although Steve Jobs touts the iPad's many built-in features, what about all those peripherals that users might want to
add to the device? Since it lacks a USB (and FireWire) port, connecting to peripherals won't be so easy. Admittedly,
Apple has said that the dock will be used for some add-ons, but that requires users to buy yet another device to get
their products to work. Omitting a USB port was a major blunder on Apple's part.

The apps won't all work well
Apple spent considerable time with developers showing off applications for the iPad. It even said that every app in the
App Store will run on the iPad without any extra tinkering on the developer's part. That said, it conveniently glossed
over the fact that any app that hasn't been updated to work with the iPad won't fit the device's display. That's a
bummer.

There are potentially better products out there
Steve Jobs said the iPad was revolutionary during the iPad announcement. But further inspection reveals that it's really
nothing more than a larger iPod Touch. More importantly, it's competing in a space where several products, including
those from Dell and HP, might provide a better tablet experience. Of course, Apple doesn't want users to know about the
competition. But they might be surprised to learn that when it comes to tablets, the iPad isn't necessarily the best
offering.
News - 12 Feb 2010 16:31 GMT
> http://www.eweek.com/c/a/Mobile-and-Wireless/10-Things-Apple-Doesnt-Want-You-to-
Know-About-the-iPad-118317/?kc=EWKNLBOE02122010FEA1
 
>
[quoted text clipped - 88 lines]
> about the competition. But they might be surprised to learn that when it
> comes to tablets, the iPad isn't necessarily the best offering.

Let the rationalizations begin!
Your Name - 12 Feb 2010 20:40 GMT
> Let the rationalizations begin!

Nope. It's just the usual anti-Apple rant made up of complete lies, nonsense
and brainless idiocy. Even remotely trying to convince such an idiot of
reality is just wasting time.
John Navas - 12 Feb 2010 21:21 GMT
>> Let the rationalizations begin!
>
>Nope. It's just the usual anti-Apple rant made up of complete lies, nonsense
>and brainless idiocy. ...

aka facts.

Signature

Best regards,
John           <http:/navasgroup.com>

If the iPhone is really so impressive,
why do iFans keep making excuses for it?

George Kerby - 12 Feb 2010 23:15 GMT
On 2/12/10 3:21 PM, in article shhbn5dodpi1cdfu0cqdpqns4k9vgp07dr@4ax.com,

>>> Let the rationalizations begin!
>>
>> Nope. It's just the usual anti-Apple rant made up of complete lies, nonsense
>> and brainless idiocy. ...
>
> aka facts.
NavASS, you wouldn't know a fact from a pile of sh.t.
nospam - 12 Feb 2010 23:22 GMT
> >Nope. It's just the usual anti-Apple rant made up of complete lies, nonsense
> >and brainless idiocy. ...
>
> aka facts.

nonsense. frequently the anti-apple bullshit is easily disproven.
Richard B. Gilbert - 13 Feb 2010 00:32 GMT
>>> Nope. It's just the usual anti-Apple rant made up of complete lies, nonsense
>>> and brainless idiocy. ...
>> aka facts.
>
> nonsense. frequently the anti-apple bullshit is easily disproven.

Is it important?  To the users of five cell phone newsgroups at least
one of which (alt.cellular.verizon) is not related in any way to the
iPad??????

PLEASE!!! TAKE IT SOMEWHERE ELSE!!!!!!!
Your Name - 13 Feb 2010 01:22 GMT
> > >Nope. It's just the usual anti-Apple rant made up of complete lies,
> > >nonsense and brainless idiocy. ...
> >
> > aka facts.
>
> nonsense. frequently the anti-apple bullshit is easily disproven.

Usually by simply reading Apple's web page for the product or actually
using the product for at least five second.
Wes Groleau - 15 Feb 2010 04:21 GMT
> Ness-Net quoted:

>> Hobbled Web surfing
>> Although Steve Jobs didn't talk about it during his keynote, the
>> device's browser doesn't support Flash. That omission ensures that a
>> large percentage of Websites won't work on the iPad. It also ensures
>> that some elements of popular Websites that don't entirely rely upon
>> Flash won't work either. It's a major problem.

True.  On the other hand it might prompt a lot of web designers
to stop depending on Flash, which would be a major benefit.  :-)

>> No multitasking
>> Those who are hoping to work in iWork and surf the Web at the same
>> time will be disappointed with the iPad. Once again, Steve Jobs failed

If this thing bears any similarity to the iPod, the word processor
and many other apps will come up in exactly the same state as you
dismissed them.  If you can click a link in a browser and edit text
at literally the SAME time, then you are using two computers with
one hand on each keyboard.

>> Where's the video output?
>> Although the iPad will boast HD content through iTunes, a quick glance
>> around the iPad reveals that there isn't a video output slot, making

If this thing bears any similarity to the iPod, the cable I paid US$35
for (or the one Apple selles for US$50) will easily transfer video and
audio to a TV, stereo amplifier, or similar.

>> Try printing

Yeah, that one might be a problem for _some_ users.  Or rather,
it might keep those folks from becoming users.

>> No DVD/Blu-ray drive

Yeah, that one might be a problem for _some_ users.  Or rather,
it might keep those folks from becoming users.

>> The $499 version is not a deal

Apparently it is for some people.

>> Reading won't be fun

I won't know that till I try it.

>> Forget about USB

Yeah, that one might be a problem for _some_ users.  Or rather,
it might keep those folks from becoming users.

>> The apps won't all work well
>> ... any app that hasn't
>> been updated to work with the iPad won't fit the device's display.
>> That's a bummer.

No, that's a stupidity.
If they are usable on the small screen, they will be usable on the
big one.  How did this idiot get a job in journalism?

>> There are potentially better products out there

Potentially?  Is there a product that could be better but isn't?
Or did he goof the word order and mean there could be a better
product but there isn't?

When I started to reply, I thought I would be refuting a couple
of items and agreeing with others.  Turns out all but one was
specious.

> Let the rationalizations begin!

You had to quote the entire rant just so you could
dismiss it without an answer?

Signature

Wes Groleau

  Pat's Polemics
  http://Ideas.Lang-Learn.us/barrett

nospam - 12 Feb 2010 17:59 GMT
> Hobbled Web surfing

it's not hobbled. it's the same safari that's on the desktop. the only
issue is flash and it's not as big of a deal as people make it out to
be. youtube video links automatically get the h.264 stream, for
example.

> No multitasking

it has multitasking.

> Where's the video output?

via the dock connector.

> Try printing

there are plenty of apps that support printing on the iphone *now*.

> No DVD/Blu-ray drive

wtf. why would there be a dvd drive in an ipad?

> The $499 version is not a deal

for some it is, for others it isn't.

> Reading won't be fun

nonsense.

> Forget about USB

oh? how do you think it connects to the computer? a usb cable is
*included* and there's an optional usb camera connector.

> The apps won't all work well

they work well now, and new apps will be even better.

> There are potentially better products out there

there are better products and worse products. different people have
different needs.
Michelle Steiner - 12 Feb 2010 18:13 GMT
> there are better products and worse products. different people have
> different needs.

It's quite amusing when an ignorant spammer forwards an article by an
ignorant author as if it were gospel.

Signature

Member National Rifle Association
Member American Civil Liberties Union
Member Human Rights Campaign
Member Arizona Road Racers

Adobe = Security Breech - 12 Feb 2010 19:21 GMT
On Feb 12, 11:25 am, "Ness-Net" <richard.nod...@nessnet.spam.com>
wrote:

MORON ALERT!

> No DVD/Blu-ray drive
> The iPad lacks an optical drive. Admittedly, the iPad is meant to be a mobile product that won't replace a computer. But
> if Apple wants to market it as an entertainment product, wouldn't it make sense to make it easy for users to view or rip
> movies and television shows on the device?

No one uses devices like this to 'rip DVDs'.
As a matter of fact I have two high end DVDs and I only use them to
rip DVD to HD. Most of our media is now STREAMED to the screen we are
going to use to look at it with.

The iPad is a perfect streaming receiver.

We use NetFlix as 90% of the rest of the US and get the occasional DVD
but stream 85% of all content we get from NetFlix.

As far as we are concerned BlockBuster is DEAD and we have a big one a
couple of blocks away. I haven't been in that place for about two
years now.
John Navas - 12 Feb 2010 19:43 GMT
>On Feb 12, 11:25 am, "Ness-Net" <richard.nod...@nessnet.spam.com>
>wrote:
>
>MORON ALERT!

And again.

>> No DVD/Blu-ray drive
>> The iPad lacks an optical drive. Admittedly, the iPad is meant to be a mobile product that won't replace a computer. But
>> if Apple wants to market it as an entertainment product, wouldn't it make sense to make it easy for users to view or rip
>> movies and television shows on the device?
>
>No one uses devices like this to 'rip DVDs'.

It would actually be nice to be able to rip DVDs and compress them for
later viewing.  

>As a matter of fact I have two high end DVDs and I only use them to
>rip DVD to HD. Most of our media is now STREAMED to the screen we are
>going to use to look at it with.
>
>The iPad is a perfect streaming receiver.

On (say) an airplane?  ;)

"It's not a limitation, it's a feature!"

Signature

Best regards,
John           <http:/navasgroup.com>

If the iPhone is really so impressive,
why do iFans keep making excuses for it?

nospam - 12 Feb 2010 23:22 GMT
> >No one uses devices like this to 'rip DVDs'.
>
> It would actually be nice to be able to rip DVDs and compress them for
> later viewing.  

do that on a desktop computer, which is probably faster than any
portable, then copy the file to the portable device.

there is absolutely no reason to put a dvd or blu-ray drive in an ipad.

> >The iPad is a perfect streaming receiver.
>
> On (say) an airplane?  ;)

on board wifi is available on many flights and it's fast enough for
streaming, and if you encode a video, as above, you won't need to
stream at all.

people use kindles on airplanes all the time, even when there is no
wifi.

> "It's not a limitation, it's a feature!"

it's not a limitation.
Michelle Steiner - 12 Feb 2010 23:57 GMT
> there is absolutely no reason to put a dvd or blu-ray drive in an ipad.

Sure there is:  to make it bigger, heavier, and ungainly, so it will be
like a Windroid's wet dream.

I didn't say it was a good reason, though.

Signature

Member National Rifle Association
Member American Civil Liberties Union
Member Human Rights Campaign
Member Arizona Road Racers

nospam - 12 Feb 2010 23:59 GMT
> > there is absolutely no reason to put a dvd or blu-ray drive in an ipad.
>
> Sure there is:  to make it bigger, heavier, and ungainly, so it will be
> like a Windroid's wet dream.

there is that. :)
Not Me - 13 Feb 2010 00:54 GMT
>> there is absolutely no reason to put a dvd or blu-ray drive in an ipad.
>
> Sure there is:  to make it bigger, heavier, and ungainly

It's already a drinks tray.  What did you have in mind, a pizza platter?
Richard B. Gilbert - 13 Feb 2010 01:00 GMT
>>> there is absolutely no reason to put a dvd or blu-ray drive in an ipad.
>>
>> Sure there is:  to make it bigger, heavier, and ungainly
>
> It's already a drinks tray.  What did you have in mind, a pizza platter?

Why must you post this gibberish to alt.cellular.verizon?

PLEASE!  Take it somewhere else?
Your Name - 13 Feb 2010 01:24 GMT
> >> there is absolutely no reason to put a dvd or blu-ray drive in an ipad.
> >
> > Sure there is:  to make it bigger, heavier, and ungainly
>
> It's already a drinks tray.  What did you have in mind, a pizza platter?

You're thinking of the Windoze tablet, which does include a DVD drive, but
only so people can use the DVD tray as a pop-out cup holder.  ;-)
NightStalker - 13 Feb 2010 09:00 GMT
> on board wifi is available on many flights and it's fast enough for
> streaming, and if you encode a video, as above, you won't need to
> stream at all.

What flights are you talking about?  No Wifi here in Australia, and
although I travel worldwide quite frequently, I've never yet come across
Wifi on a plane.  And I fly business class too...

I'm flying Singapore Airlines business class on an Airbus A380 from
Australia to London and back again in May - I must look for the Wifi...!

Signature

NightStalker

nospam - 13 Feb 2010 13:15 GMT
> What flights are you talking about?  No Wifi here in Australia, and
> although I travel worldwide quite frequently, I've never yet come across
> Wifi on a plane.  

<http://www.gogoinflight.com/>
<http://www.row44.com/>

> And I fly business class too...

doesn't matter, it's on the entire plane.

> I'm flying Singapore Airlines business class on an Airbus A380 from
> Australia to London and back again in May - I must look for the Wifi...!

gogo uses base stations on land (think cellphones but *much* bigger
cells) while row 44 is satellite based and can work over water. gogo is
in a lot of planes, while row 44 is not. southwest and alaska have
selected row 44 and they only have a couple of planes so far.
NightStalker - 14 Feb 2010 04:51 GMT
> > What flights are you talking about?  No Wifi here in Australia, and
> > although I travel worldwide quite frequently, I've never yet come across
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
> in a lot of planes, while row 44 is not. southwest and alaska have
> selected row 44 and they only have a couple of planes so far.

Thanks for that info.  I see that it is mainly overland in the USA -
necessary presumably because the base stations would be land-based.  I
thought it may have been satellite-based.

All of our overseas flights of course are over LONG stretches of ocean -
like the Pacific!  So no Wifi as far as I can see there.  And even on my
coming Singapore Airlines flight to London, a fair bit of which would be
overland Asia and Europe, there is no WiFi - I contacted Singapore
Airlines to enquire.  They don't have it.

So it's apparently limited to USA domestic flights.  Not much use to me
most of the time then.... ;)

The Row44 one, being satellite based, may have potential in the future,
but so far hasn't taken off, if you'll pardon the pun.  And heaven knows
how expensive that would be, given the extortionate rates that our
hotels etc charge per 15-minute chunks of Wifi here in Australia (and
many places overseas).  One can only imagine the rates charged by an
airline!  I don't need the internet THAT badly... ;)

Signature

NightStalker

Dennis Ferguson - 14 Feb 2010 12:12 GMT
>> gogo uses base stations on land (think cellphones but *much* bigger
>> cells) while row 44 is satellite based and can work over water. gogo is
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> overland Asia and Europe, there is no WiFi - I contacted Singapore
> Airlines to enquire.  They don't have it.

Singapore Airlines tried it out a few years ago, at least on
Singapore-Hong Kong-San Francisco flights when that route used
747's.  I got a free coupon to use the WiFi on a Hong Kong->San Francisco
flight when it was first introduced, and they were selling the service
for a while after that.  I don't remember who the provider was, but
it was satellite.

I think they charged a fairly large amount of money for the service,
though (US$25 for the flight rings a bell), and I really like to sleep
on that flight anyway, so I never used it again after the freebee.
The service disappeared altogether at about the time they switched
to smaller planes on that route, they may have given up on the service.

Dennis Ferguson
News - 14 Feb 2010 14:42 GMT
>>> gogo uses base stations on land (think cellphones but *much* bigger
>>> cells) while row 44 is satellite based and can work over water. gogo is
[quoted text clipped - 25 lines]
>
> Dennis Ferguson

Singapore offered Boeing's 'Connexion' inflight wifi service, which
folded in 2006.
SMS - 04 Mar 2010 18:23 GMT
> on board wifi is available on many flights and it's fast enough for
> streaming,

Obviously you've never used on-board Wi-Fi! I tried it on Virgin
America, and the speeds were painfully slow. No way you could stream
video, other than maybe 15fps SD. Streaming audio would work. Oh, and of
course it's not free. Virgin charges $13 for a flight over three hours.
You really have got to have a huge need to stay connected to pay that.
I'd rather buy two "adult beverages" with that money.

> and if you encode a video, as above, you won't need to
> stream at all.

This is true. I just put movies and music onto the netbook's 250GB hard
drive and I'm good to go. The power outlets on most of the planes I go
on these days are good for >4 hour flights.

I wonder how many hours of video playback the iPad will do. Software
decoding of MPEG4 and MPEG2 is very CPU intensive, but the iPad would
make a great portable entertainment device for movies.

> it's not a limitation.

Well it's more of a limitation on an iPad than on other small form
factor machines because you can't plug in any external storage, and the
internal storage is so limited. So on longer trips, you'll have to have
 a way to transfer more content onto the iPad. You can store your
content on the web somewhere and download it as needed, though this is
an extra expense, or you can bring along a laptop to dock the iPad to,
which eliminates much of the iPad's appeal.

There is no way a DVD or BlueRay drive belongs inside a tablet that
you're trying to make thin and light. But not at least providing a
standard Host USB port is a real PITA.

But not to worry, I'm sure someone will figure out a clever workaround
to get content into the iPad.
nospam - 04 Mar 2010 19:02 GMT
> > on board wifi is available on many flights and it's fast enough for
> > streaming,
>
> Obviously you've never used on-board Wi-Fi!

i use it frequently, and am actually on a plane right now, streaming a
video.

> I tried it on Virgin
> America, and the speeds were painfully slow. No way you could stream
> video, other than maybe 15fps SD. Streaming audio would work.

speed varies. gogo's bandwidth is 3 megabit to each plane. if a lot of
people are using it, then it might be slow for any one person, but
usually it's pretty good.

> Oh, and of
> course it's not free. Virgin charges $13 for a flight over three hours.
> You really have got to have a huge need to stay connected to pay that.
> I'd rather buy two "adult beverages" with that money.

promo codes are fairly easy to find, and in fact right now on the gogo
website, there's a game where you can win a 25%, 50% or 100% discount.

last winter, there was a promo where they emailed promo codes to select
users and each time a code was used, both users won a free session. not
surprisingly, people posted those codes so that others would use them.

i think they want to get people hooked on the service before they cut
back on the promos.

> > and if you encode a video, as above, you won't need to
> > stream at all.
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> decoding of MPEG4 and MPEG2 is very CPU intensive, but the iPad would
> make a great portable entertainment device for movies.

the decoding is done in hardware. 64 gig is quite a few movies, even if
they're bigger than on an ipod due to the larger screen.

> > it's not a limitation.
>
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> an extra expense, or you can bring along a laptop to dock the iPad to,
> which eliminates much of the iPad's appeal.

or directly buy/rent a movie over the air. it's also not *just* a movie
player so it's not likely people will fill it with video.

> But not to worry, I'm sure someone will figure out a clever workaround
> to get content into the iPad.

apple already did.
Noah - 04 Mar 2010 20:10 GMT
SMS,

I know this is off this topic, but you refer to using a NetBook.

They don't have CD readers so how do you put programs, like if I wanted to
put MS Office on a netbook.

Thanks

Noah

>> on board wifi is available on many flights and it's fast enough for
>> streaming,
[quoted text clipped - 33 lines]
> But not to worry, I'm sure someone will figure out a clever workaround to
> get content into the iPad.
SMS - 04 Mar 2010 20:53 GMT
> SMS,
>
> I know this is off this topic, but you refer to using a NetBook.
>
> They don't have CD readers so how do you put programs, like if I wanted to
> put MS Office on a netbook.

There are several ways.

1. Plug in an external USB DVD drive. A portable external USB powered
DVD-RW drive is less than $50, a DVD reader/CD-RW is less than $40. You
can use a line-powered USB external CD/DVD drive which is a little
cheaper, but not as convenient. See
"http://www.amazon.com/Samsung-External-Optical-SE-S084C-RSBN/dp/B002C1BBU8"
though I've seen these for less on sale.

2. Create ISO images of the installation DVDs or CDs on another computer
and transfer them to the Netbook with a USB memory stick or SD card or
external hard drive. Then use a program that creates virtual DVD and CD
ROM drives on the netbook.

The software for creating ISO images and for creating virtual drive is
available as freeware.

ImgBurn: "http://download.cnet.com/ImgBurn/3000-2646_4-10847481.html"

Virtual Clone Drive:
"http://download.cnet.com/Virtual-CloneDrive/3000-20432_4-173879.html"

You'd need a USB stick or SDHC card, an 8GB stick or 8GB SDHC card for
DVDs, which costs $15-20.

3. Same as #2, but share the ISO files on a network instead of using a
USB memory stick or SD card.

4. Same as #2, but use a USB-USB transfer cable, i.e.
"http://www.usbgear.com/computer_cable_details.cfm?sku=USBG-PC-PC&cats=160&catid=
508%2C106%2C141%2C508%2C106%2C141%2C112%2C160
"

There are other ways as well.

Incidentally, ImgBurn and Virtual Clone drive have other uses as well.
When my kids were younger I used similar programs to load all their
programs that required the CD to be in the drive onto the hard disk, and
they didn't need to deal with the CDs. I had 22 virtual CD-ROM drives
set up. There are still some programs where they expect the media to be
in the drive. Usually you can use Virtual Clone drive to get around
this, though a few game titles don't work.
Noah - 04 Mar 2010 21:15 GMT
Thanks,

I thought those would work, but wanted someone who knew to tell me before I
decided to buy a netbook.

Noah
>> SMS,
>>
[quoted text clipped - 43 lines]
> drive. Usually you can use Virtual Clone drive to get around this, though
> a few game titles don't work.
SMS - 04 Mar 2010 21:21 GMT
> Thanks,
>
> I thought those would work, but wanted someone who knew to tell me before I
> decided to buy a netbook.

You may want to pay attention to his chart as well:

"http://gadgets.boingboing.net/2008/12/17/osx-netbook-compatib.html"
Paul Miner - 04 Mar 2010 22:00 GMT
>There is no way a DVD or BlueRay drive belongs inside a tablet that
>you're trying to make thin and light. But not at least providing a
>standard Host USB port is a real PITA.

Assuming there is enough real estate along the rear or sides, I think
USB, Firewire, eSATA, and Gigabit Ethernet would all be welcome
additions for those times when you want to move data around. Strike
any from that list that already exist.

Signature

Paul Miner

SMS - 04 Mar 2010 22:22 GMT
>> There is no way a DVD or BlueRay drive belongs inside a tablet that
>> you're trying to make thin and light. But not at least providing a
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> additions for those times when you want to move data around. Strike
> any from that list that already exist.

Apple does not like ports, slots, or doors on their portable devices for
reasons that do make some sense. For the iPad, the lack of connectivity
severely limits its potential, though this was no doubt intentional as
they don't want to affect sales of MacBooks.

There are a lot of vertical market uses for a tablet with 3G
connectivity and at least USB connectivity for peripherals. Currently
these uses are being served by expensive proprietary hardware and
software. I.e. home health care professionals need USB connections for
various monitors, bar code scanners, cameras, and other equipment as
they try to reduce error-prone manually inputted data and reduce paperwork.

I worked on the first Microsoft tablet reference design and the first
Compaq tablet. It was not a big seller to the general public because of
the expense, but they sold a lot of them to vertical markets for uses
they never dreamed of. The iPad is much cheaper and lighter, with better
battery life, but without connectivity it is not very useful for those
vertical markets.
Jon Ribbens - 13 Feb 2010 12:47 GMT
> "It's not a limitation, it's a feature!"

John, is there any chance you could configure your newsreader to give
identifiable Message-IDs to your posts (e.g. ending in @navasgroup.com),
so that those of us who wish to do so may easily kill-file both your
posts and other posts which are follow-ups to your posts?

A quick google sugests that putting "MsgIdRHS=navasgroup.com" in your
AGENT.INI file should suffice.
John Navas - 13 Feb 2010 17:51 GMT
>> "It's not a limitation, it's a feature!"
>
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>A quick google sugests that putting "MsgIdRHS=navasgroup.com" in your
>AGENT.INI file should suffice.

Done.
You're welcome.
;)

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Best regards,
John           <http:/navasgroup.com>

"When the superior scholar hears of Tao, he diligently practises it.
When the average scholar hears of Tao, he sometimes retains it,
sometimes loses it. When the inferior scholar hears of Tao, he loudly
laughs at it. Were it not thus ridiculed, it would not be worthy of the
name of Tao." [Lao-Tzu]

Jon Ribbens - 13 Feb 2010 18:15 GMT
>>> "It's not a limitation, it's a feature!"
>>
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> You're welcome.
> ;)

Much appreciated. *plonk* ;-)
Michelle Steiner - 13 Feb 2010 18:24 GMT
> "When the superior scholar hears of Tao, he diligently practises it.
> When the average scholar hears of Tao, he sometimes retains it,
> sometimes loses it. When the inferior scholar hears of Tao, he loudly
> laughs at it. Were it not thus ridiculed, it would not be worthy of the
> name of Tao." [Lao-Tzu]

"When the superior scholar hears of Apple, he diligently practises it. When
the average scholar hears of Apple, he sometimes retains it, sometimes
loses it. When the inferior scholar hears of Apple, he loudly laughs at it.
Were it not thus ridiculed, it would not be worthy of the name of Apple."
[praphrased from Lao-Tzu]

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John Navas - 13 Feb 2010 18:47 GMT
>> "When the superior scholar hears of Tao, he diligently practises it.
>> When the average scholar hears of Tao, he sometimes retains it,
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
>Were it not thus ridiculed, it would not be worthy of the name of Apple."
>[praphrased from Lao-Tzu]

You are too funny!
I've not drunk the Kool-aid, so I can only shake my head in awe!

Signature

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John           <http:/navasgroup.com>

If the iPhone is really so impressive,
why do iFans keep making excuses for it?

Michelle Steiner - 13 Feb 2010 19:08 GMT
> >> "When the superior scholar hears of Tao, he diligently practises it.
> >> When the average scholar hears of Tao, he sometimes retains it,
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> You are too funny!
> I've not drunk the Kool-aid, so I can only shake my head in awe!

Oh, you've drunk from the anti-Apple Kool-aid, by the buckets, as
demonstrated by your over-the-top ranting.

Thanks for demonstrating that you're an inferior scholar.

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John Navas - 13 Feb 2010 19:20 GMT
>> >> "When the superior scholar hears of Tao, he diligently practises it.
>> >> When the average scholar hears of Tao, he sometimes retains it,
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
>Oh, you've drunk from the anti-Apple Kool-aid, by the buckets, as
>demonstrated by your over-the-top ranting.

That's just your Kool-aid talking.
Try taking off the Apple-colored glasses.

>Thanks for demonstrating that you're an inferior scholar.

Ad hominem, the final refuge of those with nothing persuasive to say.
Thanks for conceding the point.

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John           <http:/navasgroup.com>

If the iPhone is really so impressive,
why do iFans keep making excuses for it?

George Kerby - 13 Feb 2010 19:43 GMT
On 2/13/10 1:20 PM, in article
goudn5hk94ln5ljhg5co4i7k9j456pep80@navasgroup.com, "John Navas"
<spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote:

>>>>> "When the superior scholar hears of Tao, he diligently practises it.
>>>>> When the average scholar hears of Tao, he sometimes retains it,
[quoted text clipped - 21 lines]
> Ad hominem, the final refuge of those with nothing persuasive to say.
> Thanks for conceding the point.

Thanks for proving that you don't have any form of a life...
nospam - 13 Feb 2010 19:47 GMT
> >> You are too funny!
> >> I've not drunk the Kool-aid, so I can only shake my head in awe!
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> Ad hominem, the final refuge of those with nothing persuasive to say.
> Thanks for conceding the point.

calling someone a koolaid drinker is itself an ad hominem, so you
conceded first.
Michelle Steiner - 14 Feb 2010 00:16 GMT
> calling someone a koolaid drinker is itself an ad hominem, so you
> conceded first.

Actually, neither is an ad hominem.

An ad hominem argument, also known as argumentum ad hominem (Latin:
"argument toward the person" or "argument against the person") is an
argument which links the validity of a premise to an irrelevant
characteristic or belief of the person advocating the premise.

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John Navas - 14 Feb 2010 02:45 GMT
>> calling someone a koolaid drinker is itself an ad hominem, so you
>> conceded first.
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>argument which links the validity of a premise to an irrelevant
>characteristic or belief of the person advocating the premise.

"And now for the _rest_ of the story" (actual definition of ad hominem
from Random House Unabridged Dictionary):

1.    appealing to one's prejudices, emotions, or special interests
rather than to one's intellect or reason.

2.    attacking an opponent's character rather than answering his
argument.

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John           <http:/navasgroup.com>

If the iPhone is really so impressive,
why do iFans keep making excuses for it?

Michelle Steiner - 14 Feb 2010 02:57 GMT
> >> calling someone a koolaid drinker is itself an ad hominem, so you
> >> conceded first.
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
> 1.    appealing to one's prejudices, emotions, or special interests rather
> than to one's intellect or reason.

As you so often do.

> 2.    attacking an opponent's character rather than answering his argument.

As you so often do.

So stop whining when someone reacts in kind to your ad hominems.  Nah, you
won't stop whining; bullies and wannabe bullies always whine when people
stand up to them.

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John Navas - 14 Feb 2010 03:10 GMT
>> >> calling someone a koolaid drinker is itself an ad hominem, so you
>> >> conceded first.
[quoted text clipped - 21 lines]
>won't stop whining; bullies and wannabe bullies always whine when people
>stand up to them.

Thanks for the gracious concession.

I find it hard to understand why you would want to humiliate yourself
with such childish behavior.

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John           <http:/navasgroup.com>

If the iPhone is really so impressive,
why do iFans keep making excuses for it?

Michelle Steiner - 14 Feb 2010 04:53 GMT
> >So stop whining when someone reacts in kind to your ad hominems.  Nah,
> >you won't stop whining; bullies and wannabe bullies always whine when
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> I find it hard to understand why you would want to humiliate yourself
> with such childish behavior.

You are out of touch with reality, trollboi.

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John Navas - 14 Feb 2010 05:41 GMT
>> >So stop whining when someone reacts in kind to your ad hominems.  Nah,
>> >you won't stop whining; bullies and wannabe bullies always whine when
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>
>You are out of touch with reality, trollboi.

"There you go again."

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John           <http:/navasgroup.com>

If the iPhone is really so impressive,
why do iFans keep making excuses for it?

George Kerby - 14 Feb 2010 15:49 GMT
On 2/13/10 9:10 PM, in article
s5qen5hb0c3c80vjcjgcjptn8lfh5u369a@navasgroup.com, "John Navas"
<spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote:

>>>>> calling someone a koolaid drinker is itself an ad hominem, so you
>>>>> conceded first.
[quoted text clipped - 26 lines]
> I find it hard to understand why you would want to humiliate yourself
> with such childish behavior.

Because your are the epitome and embodiment of silly juvinile behavior?

Monkey see, monkey do, NavASS!
nospam - 14 Feb 2010 03:02 GMT
> > calling someone a koolaid drinker is itself an ad hominem, so you
> > conceded first.
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> argument which links the validity of a premise to an irrelevant
> characteristic or belief of the person advocating the premise.

it's his 'out' whenever someone proves him wrong. inevitably, there's
some condescending remark somewhere along the way, however slight, and
he jumps on it to weasel out of his losing the debate. in many cases,
he even copy/pastes the exit statement.
John Navas - 14 Feb 2010 03:09 GMT
>> > calling someone a koolaid drinker is itself an ad hominem, so you
>> > conceded first.
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
>he jumps on it to weasel out of his losing the debate. in many cases,
>he even copy/pastes the exit statement.

Thanks for proving my point.

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John           <http:/navasgroup.com>

If the iPhone is really so impressive,
why do iFans keep making excuses for it?

Michelle Steiner - 14 Feb 2010 00:14 GMT
> >Oh, you've drunk from the anti-Apple Kool-aid, by the buckets, as
> >demonstrated by your over-the-top ranting.
>
> That's just your Kool-aid talking.
> Try taking off the Apple-colored glasses.

I ain't the one drinking the Kool-aid.  And I'm the one who is seeing
clearly.

> >Thanks for demonstrating that you're an inferior scholar.
>
> Ad hominem, the final refuge of those with nothing persuasive to say.

First of all, it's not an ad hominem.  Secondly, you are one of the last
people who should be claiming that others have nothing persuasive to say.  
Glass houses, stones, and all that.

> Thanks for conceding the point.

All I did was point out facts.

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George Kerby - 13 Feb 2010 19:42 GMT
On 2/13/10 12:47 PM, in article
hrsdn5djklo1t7fd8ei510vanhbbf3kh3a@navasgroup.com, "John Navas"
<spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote:

>>> "When the superior scholar hears of Tao, he diligently practises it.
>>> When the average scholar hears of Tao, he sometimes retains it,
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> You are too funny!
> I've not drunk the Kool-aid, so I can only shake my head in awe!

No, NavASS, you're drunk with your self.

You are a pompous fool and she wa just pointing out your hypocrisy.

Like usual, it went "whoosh", right over your pointy little empty cranium.
Larry - 14 Feb 2010 09:29 GMT
"Adobe = Security Breech" <vic.healey@gmail.com> wrote in news:0caa466f-
b508-436a-8a32-a3275d2c61aa@a5g2000yqi.googlegroups.com:

> The iPad is a perfect streaming receiver.

Bullshit.  70% of the streaming is a downloaded FLASH app from the content
provider to control content piracy.  iPad will play none of it unless the
content provider sets up a proprietary iPhone/iPaD/iTouch ONLY server for
it...which most are not willing or able to do.

Like it or not..."media" means FLASH from Adobe.com

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Larry

nospam - 14 Feb 2010 09:42 GMT
> 70% of the streaming is a downloaded FLASH app from the content
> provider to control content piracy.  iPad will play none of it unless the
> content provider sets up a proprietary iPhone/iPaD/iTouch ONLY server for
> it...which most are not willing or able to do.

wrong. flash is what's proprietary. for ipad/iphone/ipod touch, all it
needs to do is stream a *standard* h.264 stream, which can be watched
on just about any platform.
Larry - 14 Feb 2010 10:39 GMT
nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote in news:140220100142285883%
nospam@nospam.invalid:

> wrong. flash is what's proprietary. for ipad/iphone/ipod touch, all it
> needs to do is stream a *standard* h.264 stream, which can be watched
> on just about any platform.

Everybody ELSE has Flash that support streaming.  FLASH denial is used by
the carriers to deny streaming access to the masses.

Flash player is free, and always has been.  Content without a player is
suicide.

I've never been denied a Flash player....EXCEPT on a SELLPHONE.

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Larry

nospam - 14 Feb 2010 19:05 GMT
> Flash player is free, and always has been.  Content without a player is
> suicide.

flash is not an open standard. had it been apple instead of adobe who
created flash, you'd be very against it.
Larry - 14 Feb 2010 21:09 GMT
nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote in news:140220101105314674%
nospam@nospam.invalid:

>> Flash player is free, and always has been.  Content without a player is
>> suicide.
>
> flash is not an open standard. had it been apple instead of adobe who
> created flash, you'd be very against it.

You, a.shole that you are, are correct.  But, alas, a.shole, Flash is what
the webpages require to play content.  No Flash, no content.

Tell your Jobs....geez

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Larry

George Kerby - 14 Feb 2010 21:11 GMT
On 2/14/10 3:09 PM, in article Xns9D1FA46A75BB7noonehomecom@74.209.131.13,

> nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote in news:140220101105314674%
> nospam@nospam.invalid:
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> You, a.shole that you are, are correct.  But, alas, a.shole, Flash is what
> the webpages require to play content.  No Flash, no content.

Deeper n' deeper...
Michelle Steiner - 14 Feb 2010 22:32 GMT
> flash is not an open standard. had it been apple instead of adobe who
> created flash, you'd be very against it.

No matter what it is, if it's by Apple, Larry is against it.

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George Kerby - 15 Feb 2010 01:33 GMT
On 2/14/10 4:32 PM, in article
michelle-0952CE.15325014022010@news.eternal-september.org, "Michelle
Steiner" <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:

>> flash is not an open standard. had it been apple instead of adobe who
>> created flash, you'd be very against it.
>
> No matter what it is, if it's by Apple, Larry is against it.

Him and NavASS. Peas in a pod.
Michelle Steiner - 15 Feb 2010 01:42 GMT
> > No matter what it is, if it's by Apple, Larry is against it.
>
> Him and NavASS. Peas in a pod.

They remind me of the elephants in this cartoon, except that they're not
questioning themselves.

<http://blogs.ajc.com/mike-luckovich/files/2010/02/mike02142010.jpg>

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Larry - 14 Feb 2010 09:32 GMT
"Adobe = Security Breech" <vic.healey@gmail.com> wrote in news:0caa466f-
b508-436a-8a32-a3275d2c61aa@a5g2000yqi.googlegroups.com:

> We use NetFlix as 90% of the rest of the US and get the occasional DVD
> but stream 85% of all content we get from NetFlix.

What are the system requirements to watch movies instantly on my PC or Mac?
You must have a computer running Windows or Mac OS X and an active
broadband connection to the Internet.

   * Windows requirements: Windows XP with Service Pack 2 or higher;
Windows Vista; Windows 7; Internet Explorer 6.0 or higher or Firefox 2 or
higher; 1.2 GHz processor; 512 MB RAM.
   * Mac OS X requirements: an Intel-based Mac with OS 10.4.8 or later;
Safari 3 or higher; Firefox 2 or higher; 1 GB RAM.

These computers run FLASH.  Even the Netflix home page runs FLASH!

No FLASH, no Netflix.

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Paul Miner - 14 Feb 2010 18:12 GMT
>We use NetFlix as 90% of the rest of the US and get the occasional DVD
>but stream 85% of all content we get from NetFlix.

I'm surprised to hear that NetFlix has penetrated 90% of the US. I
would have expected the number to be closer to 3%.

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Paul Miner

Larry - 14 Feb 2010 09:24 GMT
> There are potentially better products out there
> Steve Jobs said the iPad was revolutionary during the iPad announcement. But further inspection reveals that it's really
> nothing more than a larger iPod Touch. More importantly, it's competing in a space where several products, including
> those from Dell and HP, might provide a better tablet experience. Of course, Apple doesn't want users to know about the
> competition. But they might be surprised to learn that when it comes to tablets, the iPad isn't necessarily the best
> offering.

Ipad will NEVER be a portable computing device that competes with the
horrendously overpriced Macbook Air or other Mac portable computing
devices.

iPad is NOT a computer.  It's the next generation of WebTV to connect the
ill-informed, uneducated clod to Cloud Computing and the Apple Box Office
to be fleeced on a bigger screen.

Vic made a big deal out of some Cloud-based notepad app that RENTS for
$45/year to store notes and "any file", as long as that file is under 25MB
and you don't use more than 500KB/month on their server.  More proof of the
direction Jobs is trying to steer the sheep away from their real computers.

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Larry

George Kerby - 14 Feb 2010 15:50 GMT
On 2/14/10 3:24 AM, in article Xns9D1F2CD30F3E4noonehomecom@74.209.131.13,

>> There are potentially better products out there
>> Steve Jobs said the iPad was revolutionary during the iPad announcement.
[quoted text clipped - 19 lines]
> and you don't use more than 500KB/month on their server.  More proof of the
> direction Jobs is trying to steer the sheep away from their real computers.

Take it to the Waffle House, Lar. You're waaaaaay over your head.
Your Name - 14 Feb 2010 20:13 GMT
> On 2/14/10 3:24 AM, in article Xns9D1F2CD30F3E4noonehomecom@74.209.131.13,
> >
[quoted text clipped - 23 lines]
>
> Take it to the Waffle House, Lar. You're waaaaaay over your head.

Anything more complicated than counting to five is WAY above Loser Larry's
head.
 
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