T-Mobile and Nokia 3650 confusions

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Norris Watkins - 21 Dec 2003 06:38 GMT

I got this wonderful phone ( Nokia 3650 ) recently, and is still
learning its features.

1. T-Mobile sells 2 types of T - zones, one 4.99 per month and ther
other 9.99. Both are unlimited data at 56Kbps. But the service
representative could not tell me what the difference is between the
plans, except for the word "corporate emails". What did she mean by
corporate emails - support for protocols other than pop3, like MS
exchange/outlook, lotus etc ?

2. When I access an ordinary ( *non* wap ) web site in my 3650, it
takes really a long time, though it is supposed to be 56 Kbps. Is this
expected ? Is this because the phone is busy converting the ordinary
html website to WML.

3. The service rep told me that the phone works with about XHTML. But
my understanding is that it uses WML ( equivalent to HTML under http
protocol ), a subset of XHTML. Who is right ?

4. Since the web browser 3650 has is a WML browser, when I access an
ordinary website, where is the html -> wml conversion happening ? Is
it inside the phone, or is T-mobile gateway is doing it on my behalf.

5. Will my website access be fast if I access a pure wap site. Can
somebody provide me the url for a wap site.

6. Does 3650 support cookies based login ( say yahoo mail )

7. When I accessed sites that requires the user to input data ( like
the login screen with mail.yahoo.com ), I could not find a way to
input data. When I pressed the keys, no data showed up in the login
text box. Is this possible at all with Nokia 3650 ?

8. With this 4.95 plan is it possible to use my laptop through the
infrared port, and access internet inside my laptop using full fledged
browser like IE. ( I m *not* asking about using 3650 as a wireless
modem, in conjunction with my own personal ISP )

9. T-mobile also sells a plan for 19.95 per month, for accessing web
in laptop using a wireless pcmcia card. Is it possible to use 3650
with the same plan ( with bluetooth or infrared used to connect the
laptop with the phone ) ( This way I will be able to save money as I
wont be buying the pcmcia card )

10. Is the pcmcia card they sell ( 200 $ or so ) a generic GSM one,
that could be used with similar data services from other companies (
assuming it could be GSM unlocked ). Or is it tied with T-mobile -
useless with any other carrier.

Thanks for reading the long line of questions. Even partial answers
will be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
-NW

Reply to this Message

Tommy - 21 Dec 2003 16:28 GMT

You should do a little google-ing before posting this. This stuff is
all over.

However, first here are two sites for you to look at:

http://wwww.nokia3650.net
http://www.howardforums.com

HF has LOTS of great info from tech savvy users.

Download a 3rd party browser like Doris or Opera. You have to pay,
but much better than the included WAP browser

To dial out with your PC, create a DUN connection with the number to
dial as:

*99#

The username and password are blank. Use the bluetooth or IRda modem.
This should give you a direct GPRS connection.

-T

Reply to this Message

Todd Allcock - 21 Dec 2003 17:00 GMT

> I got this wonderful phone ( Nokia 3650 ) recently, and is still
> learning its features.
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> corporate emails - support for protocols other than pop3, like MS
> exchange/outlook, lotus etc ?

Yes. POP3 access is included in the $4.99 plan.

> 2. When I access an ordinary ( *non* wap ) web site in my 3650, it
> takes really a long time, though it is supposed to be 56 Kbps. Is this
> expected ? Is this because the phone is busy converting the ordinary
> html website to WML.

I don't think it's "converting" anything- just trying to display HTML
data using it's browser's rendering engine. Browsing on my 3650's
screen is much slower than browsing with my PPC tethered to the 3650.

> 3. The service rep told me that the phone works with about XHTML. But
> my understanding is that it uses WML ( equivalent to HTML under http
> protocol ), a subset of XHTML. Who is right ?

I believe the owner's manual calls it a "subset of XHTML."

> 4. Since the web browser 3650 has is a WML browser, when I access an
> ordinary website, where is the html -> wml conversion happening ? Is
> it inside the phone, or is T-mobile gateway is doing it on my behalf.

Nowhere. The browser is simply trying to display the info using
XHTML. Some websites render ok, some don't. (Kind of like trying to
use Netscape 2.0 or IE 3.0- many websites work, but the Browser will
ignore code it doesn't understand.

Being a Symbian phone, you can buy and install HTML browsers into the
phone (Opera, Doris, NetFront, WebViewer) and have more compatibility
with the "real web".

> 5. Will my website access be fast if I access a pure wap site. Can
> somebody provide me the url for a wap site.

wap.yahoo.com

> 6. Does 3650 support cookies based login ( say yahoo mail )

Not sure- sometimes mine remembers, sometimes it forgets. I usually
browse the web with my PPC, so I haven't investigated fully.

> 7. When I accessed sites that requires the user to input data ( like
> the login screen with mail.yahoo.com ), I could not find a way to
> input data. When I pressed the keys, no data showed up in the login
> text box. Is this possible at all with Nokia 3650 ?

You need to scroll to the text box then "select" it (push the center
of the direction pad or "send". Then you can type the text and
"select" again to exit the input mode and continue navigating.

> 8. With this 4.95 plan is it possible to use my laptop through the
> infrared port, and access internet inside my laptop using full fledged
> browser like IE. ( I m *not* asking about using 3650 as a wireless
> modem, in conjunction with my own personal ISP )

Yes. You dial *99***1# to connect via GPRS using your 4.99 plan. I
do it with my PPC every day.

> 9. T-mobile also sells a plan for 19.95 per month, for accessing web
> in laptop using a wireless pcmcia card. Is it possible to use 3650
> with the same plan ( with bluetooth or infrared used to connect the
> laptop with the phone ) ( This way I will be able to save money as I
> wont be buying the pcmcia card )

Yes. You can do VPN as well as FTP with that option.

> 10. Is the pcmcia card they sell ( 200 $ or so ) a generic GSM one,
> that could be used with similar data services from other companies (
> assuming it could be GSM unlocked ). Or is it tied with T-mobile -
> useless with any other carrier.

I believe it's locked based on prior posts on this NG. I only have
the old Merlin card and have never used it with another carrier.

> Thanks for reading the long line of questions. Even partial answers
> will be greatly appreciated.
> Thanks
> -NW

No biggie! Hope I helped a little. Enjoy the 3650, it's a killer
phone.!

Reply to this Message

Matthew - 21 Dec 2003 17:42 GMT

>> I got this wonderful phone ( Nokia 3650 ) recently, and is still
>> learning its features.
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
>
>Yes. POP3 access is included in the $4.99 plan.

You don't need either T-Zones package for pop3 access. The T-Zones
packages only give you t-mobile's wireless content pages, that can be
had else where for free anyway.

>> 2. When I access an ordinary ( *non* wap ) web site in my 3650, it
>> takes really a long time, though it is supposed to be 56 Kbps. Is this
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>data using it's browser's rendering engine. Browsing on my 3650's
>screen is much slower than browsing with my PPC tethered to the 3650.

3650's built-in browser isn't that great and it does take it a while
to render, which is what you're seeing in the time delay.

>> 4. Since the web browser 3650 has is a WML browser, when I access an
>> ordinary website, where is the html -> wml conversion happening ? Is
>> it inside the phone, or is T-mobile gateway is doing it on my behalf.

The browser is HTML capable, even if it slower than molasses.

>> 8. With this 4.95 plan is it possible to use my laptop through the
>> infrared port, and access internet inside my laptop using full fledged
>> browser like IE. ( I m *not* asking about using 3650 as a wireless
>> modem, in conjunction with my own personal ISP )

Again you don't even need that much to use it with your laptop. You
can use the free wap just the same.

>> 9. T-mobile also sells a plan for 19.95 per month, for accessing web
>> in laptop using a wireless pcmcia card. Is it possible to use 3650
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>
>Yes. You can do VPN as well as FTP with that option.

the 19.99 just gives you all the ports you'd have with a normal ISP,
including FTP and upon request you can have VPN which gives you an
addressable IP address.

>> 10. Is the pcmcia card they sell ( 200 $ or so ) a generic GSM one,
>> that could be used with similar data services from other companies (
>> assuming it could be GSM unlocked ). Or is it tied with T-mobile -
>> useless with any other carrier.

the PC Cards are basically small data phones and thus aren't really
any different except they have been made to handle data better. Some
also are voice capable with a headset but not all.
Matthew

matthew at the dash stevens dot us

Reply to this Message

Bellsouth - 21 Dec 2003 20:12 GMT

Thanks really Matthew Todd:

Some comments below.

> >> I got this wonderful phone ( Nokia 3650 ) recently, and is still
> >> learning its features.
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> >
> >Yes. POP3 access is included in the $4.99 plan.

I understand from your mail below that the ports for pop3 will be opened
with the 4.99 plan.

But I got a bit confused with you saying that, to access internet even this
is not required. I thought one needs to have at least the 4.99 plan turned
on to have any data capabilities at all ( GPRS ). ( Otherwise he will have
to somehow dial his own personal ISP using 3650 as a wireless modem. This
will not only consume your ait time, but also will result in much lower data
speed 9600 Kbps or so ).
So if I dont have GPRS at all, why are you saying that "you don't even need
that much to use it with your laptop. You can use the free wap just the
same". Did you mean using my own isp using the air time ?

> You don't need either T-Zones package for pop3 access. The T-Zones
> packages only give you t-mobile's wireless content pages, that can be
> had else where for free anyway.

Could you pl clarify this. Did you mean access to the url
http://wap.voicestream.net ?

Are you saying that access to this page is all 4.99 is giving me ?
If I remember correctly, I got a "service no available" message, before I
activated the T-zones plan, before when I tried to access a url

> >> 2. When I access an ordinary ( *non* wap ) web site in my 3650, it
> >> takes really a long time, though it is supposed to be 56 Kbps. Is this
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> 3650's built-in browser isn't that great and it does take it a while
> to render, which is what you're seeing in the time delay.

Thanks. Now I understand that 3650 has an html browser. It does not support
all the html tags, and it is slow. But third party browsers can be purchased
that are better than the one it came with.

Could you pl tell what PPC is ( Apple's Power PC ? )
How did you connect 3650 with the PC ? infrared ? If yes, what software did
you use ?

> >> 8. With this 4.95 plan is it possible to use my laptop through the
> >> infrared port, and access internet inside my laptop using full fledged
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> Again you don't even need that much to use it with your laptop. You
> can use the free wap just the same.

"Free wap" sounds very tempting. But as I asked above, I did not understand
this fully.

> >> 9. T-mobile also sells a plan for 19.95 per month, for accessing web
> >> in laptop using a wireless pcmcia card. Is it possible to use 3650
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> >
> >Yes. You can do VPN as well as FTP with that option.

I see. This is indeed very valuable info. So with this plan will allow me to
use my phone just like an ISP, with all the TCP/UDP ports open.
But if internet is my only objective ( port 80 ), I do not need this at
all. ( 4.95 plan gives me equal speed - 56 Kbps ). Did I get this right ?

And for browsing, I can access www ( only www ) at full speed on my PC, with
4.95 plan. I will be seeing the complete page in all its glory on the PC.

Where does wap ( A simplified version of the original web page ) come in
the picture then.

By the way it looks like - after 3 customer service calls - the only
difference between the 4.95 plan and the 9.95 plan is their support for the
email protocols commonly used in corporations - like Lotus notes, MS
exchange etc. Is this true.

Thanks again ( and again ) Matthew and Todd

--nw

> the 19.99 just gives you all the ports you'd have with a normal ISP,
> including FTP and upon request you can have VPN which gives you an
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
>
> matthew at the dash stevens dot us

Reply to this Message

tuned by R?ZO - 22 Dec 2003 05:06 GMT

| > >> I got this wonderful phone ( Nokia 3650 ) recently, and is still
| > >> learning its features.
[quoted text clipped - 49 lines]
|
| Could you pl tell what PPC is ( Apple's Power PC ? )

PPC is Pocket PC (PDA).

| How did you connect 3650 with the PC ? infrared ? If yes, what software did
| you use ?
[quoted text clipped - 52 lines]
| >
| > matthew at the dash stevens dot us

Reply to this Message

Todd Allcock - 22 Dec 2003 05:57 GMT

> I understand from your mail below that the ports for pop3 will be opened
> with the 4.99 plan.
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> will not only consume your ait time, but also will result in much lower data
> speed 9600 Kbps or so ).

T-Mo gives GPRS access for free now, so all of their customers can buy
ringtones and java apps from them. I apologize, but I didn't know
POP3 was available without a T-Zones plan (I subscribe to T-Zones
because I find the WAP pages quick and useful for news, weather,
movietimes, etc.)

> So if I dont have GPRS at all, why are you saying that "you don't even need
> that much to use it with your laptop. You can use the free wap just the
> same". Did you mean using my own isp using the air time ?

No, you can use GPRS for free, but you won't have access to T-Mo's
"WAP deck"

> Could you pl clarify this. Did you mean access to the url
> http://wap.voicestream.net ?

Sort of- you'll only be able to download ringtones from there, but you
could surf non-T-Mo WAP sires (like Yahoo, Google, etc.) as well as
browse the web.

> Are you saying that access to this page is all 4.99 is giving me ?
> If I remember correctly, I got a "service no available" message, before I
> activated the T-zones plan, before when I tried to access a url

Probably because your browser was configured to home into T-Zones.

> Thanks. Now I understand that 3650 has an html browser. It does not support
> all the html tags, and it is slow. But third party browsers can be purchased
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> How did you connect 3650 with the PC ? infrared ? If yes, what software did
> you use ?

PPC is a Pocket PC (in my case, a Dell Axim X5) handheld. I can use
IR or bluetooth to connect.

I've also used an old Toshiba laptop via IR.

As for software, I simply configured Windows DUN (dial-up networking)
to use a "generic IR modem" and dial *99***1# (that "phone number"
connects you via GPRS.)

> "Free wap" sounds very tempting. But as I asked above, I did not understand
> this fully.

"Free WAP" really means free GPRS. You are only limited by the
capabilities of your browser.

> I see. This is indeed very valuable info. So with this plan will allow me to
> use my phone just like an ISP, with all the TCP/UDP ports open.
> But if internet is my only objective ( port 80 ), I do not need this at
> all. ( 4.95 plan gives me equal speed - 56 Kbps ). Did I get this right ?

Or for free. All are equal speed.

> And for browsing, I can access www ( only www ) at full speed on my PC, with
> 4.95 plan. I will be seeing the complete page in all its glory on the PC.

Yes, or for free.

> Where does wap ( A simplified version of the original web page ) come in
> the picture then.

Many of us stick to WAP sites when browsing with the phone itself,
because WAP pages display better and faster. To lookup a phone number
on the PC you might use whitepages.com, but on the phone,
www.555-1212.com/palm loads faster, for example. www.ebay.com on the
PC, mmm.ebay.com on the phone, etc.

> By the way it looks like - after 3 customer service calls - the only
> difference between the 4.95 plan and the 9.95 plan is their support for the
> email protocols commonly used in corporations - like Lotus notes, MS
> exchange etc. Is this true.

Yes.

> Thanks again ( and again ) Matthew and Todd

Enjoy!

Play with the T-Zones WAP before cancelling the $4.95 service- you
might find it useful enough to keep. Many times I can get the info I
want with a few keypresses rather than firing up my handheld, or
worse, the laptop!

Reply to this Message

Matthew - 22 Dec 2003 06:00 GMT

>I understand from your mail below that the ports for pop3 will be opened
>with the 4.99 plan.
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
>that much to use it with your laptop. You can use the free wap just the
>same". Did you mean using my own isp using the air time ?

All the T-Mobile plans now include Free WAP that is no difference from
T-Zones (4.99) except that you don't have access to the content
(stocks, weather, etc) that T-mobile provides. That's no big deal
because you can get it else where for free anyway (i.e. Yahoo, MSN,
etc.)

The port open on Free WAP, T-Zones & T-Zones Pro are 25 SMTP, 80 HTTP,
110 POP3, 143 IMAP.

With the Internet and Internet VPN you call all the ports plus the
T-Zones content because it includes T-Zones and unlimited Picture
Messaging.

Matthew

matthew at the dash stevens dot us

Reply to this Message

gopi - 22 Dec 2003 19:25 GMT

> The port open on Free WAP, T-Zones & T-Zones Pro are 25 SMTP, 80 HTTP,
> 110 POP3, 143 IMAP.

imaps (port 993) and pops (port 995) are also open, as well as UDP for
DNS (port 53)

> With the Internet and Internet VPN you call all the ports plus the
> T-Zones content because it includes T-Zones and unlimited Picture
> Messaging.

You get unlimited picture messaging with the $19.99/month plan? It's
not mentioned on T-Mobile's web site...

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