Home | Contact Us | FAQ | Search & Site Map | Link to Us
Sign In | Join | Other 45 Sites in Network
Home
Discussion Groups
General
General TopicsGSMBluetooth
Providers
AlltelATT WirelessCingularFidoNextelSprint PCST-MobileVerizon
Manufacturers
EricssonNokiaMotorola
Country Specific
Australian GroupUK Group
Related Topics
PocketPCPalmMore Topics ...

Cellular Phone Forum / General / GSM / January 2004

Tip: Looking for answers? Try searching our database.

Newbie alert - GSM network selection question

Thread view: 
Enable EMail Alerts  Start New Thread
Thread rating: 
Chris Woodfield - 31 Dec 2003 19:09 GMT
Hello,

I've got a question regarding GSM network selection. Let's say I
subscribe to provider T. There are towers belonging to provider T,
provider A, and provider C that serve my location. Provider A has a
roaming agreement with provider T, but Provider C does not.

My question is this: what mechanism or protocol determines whose
providers' signals my phone can "see"? Does each tower broadcast a list
of networks it provides service for, or is it more complicated than that?

Next question: in the above example, My phone can see two towers that it
is capable of making calls through. How does the phone decide which
tower to use? Does it use the strongest signal, or will it prefer a
tower belonging to my provider if available?

Thanks,

-C
Gordon Brown - 31 Dec 2003 21:37 GMT
> I've got a question regarding GSM network selection. Let's say I
> subscribe to provider T. There are towers belonging to provider T,
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> providers' signals my phone can "see"? Does each tower broadcast a list
> of networks it provides service for, or is it more complicated than that?

On the first-time-power-up, you GSM phone will see all the GSM broadcast
from all the towers. It will decode the Network ID Code from the broadcast
and compare this against the Network Code on the SIM. It will always choose
its home network against all other Networks even if the home network signal
is weaker than the others. Only if it cannot communicate with its home
network will it attempt to communicate with the other networks on a list
stored in the SIM.

> Next question: in the above example, My phone can see two towers that it
> is capable of making calls through. How does the phone decide which
> tower to use? Does it use the strongest signal, or will it prefer a
> tower belonging to my provider if available?

There is a list of Networks in the SIM that the phone roam on (and this list
is order with the preferred Networks first). This means that when the phone
cannot communicate with its home network, it will pick one that it can from
this list. If there is more than one available, it will try the preferred
one first regardless of signal strength.

Actually while the phone will use the signal strength of a signal to
initially select potential candidates, it actually uses the Received Quality
(RxQual) measurement to decide which channels are real candidates. (The
RxQual measurement is a measure of the number of bits received without
error, the higher the better!). This is because a strong signal may not be
decoded (or decoded with a high error) due to co-channel interference (it is
quite possible that it is the interference that is giving the strong signal
measurement).

Hope this helps.
Chris Woodfield - 31 Dec 2003 22:03 GMT
>>I've got a question regarding GSM network selection. Let's say I
>>subscribe to provider T. There are towers belonging to provider T,
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
> network will it attempt to communicate with the other networks on a list
> stored in the SIM.

So, if I'm understanding this correctly, the list of my provider's
roaming partners is stored on my SIM in the phone...if that is the case,
is the SIM updated when there is a new roaming agreements with a carrier
not on the list, or when a provider terminates an existing roaming
agreement?

-C
Gordon Brown - 01 Jan 2004 00:37 GMT
> > On the first-time-power-up, you GSM phone will see all the GSM broadcast
> > from all the towers. It will decode the Network ID Code from the broadcast
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> not on the list, or when a provider terminates an existing roaming
> agreement?

Okay, my explanation is somewhat over simplified because this is actually a
very complex matter which the GSM standards also give some latitude to the
handset manufacturer. There is also a difference between automatic selection
and manual selection, plus the subscriber is normally allowed to edit the
preferred list of Public Land Mobile Network (PLMN) stored in the SIM.

The important points are that the home PLMN is a special case which the
handset must search for on power up; If this is not found than, and only
then can it consider alternative PLMN (sometimes referred to as VPLMN). When
a GSM subscriber signs up for roaming, a SIM update is normally sent to the
subscriber's equipment. This will normally update the list of preferred PLMN
(which will also include the Home PLMN) and a list of forbidden PLMN. But as
you correctly pointed out, it will be impossible to maintain such a list as
new agreements could be constantly set-up and terminated. So the equipment
also self-learns which network it can work on by the location updates during
roaming. If a VPLMN rejects a location update from the handset terminal this
is added to a list stored in the handset (and not the SIM) so that it will
not attempt to access this VPLMN again.

But this presents a problem, what if some time later an agreement is set-up
with this VPLMN? The standards do not deal with this and this is left to the
equipment manufacturer to deal with. Anyway, I think this simple explanation
describes briefly how it all just about hangs together!
Jer - 31 Dec 2003 23:37 GMT
> Hello,
>
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> providers' signals my phone can "see"? Does each tower broadcast a list
> of networks it provides service for, or is it more complicated than that?

No, each tower only broadcasts it's own netork credentials, and your
handset is expected to determine which network it attempts to register on.

> Next question: in the above example, My phone can see two towers that it
> is capable of making calls through. How does the phone decide which
> tower to use? Does it use the strongest signal, or will it prefer a
> tower belonging to my provider if available?

Inside your handset is an area of memory which stores what is called the
IRDB (Intellignet Roaming DataBase).  The IRDB contains the necessary
info for determining which networks are available for you to use.  Your
home carrier periodically provides automatic IRDB updates over the air,
but only when one is actually regostered on your home network, not while
roaming somewhere else.  Based on your carrier's preferences downloaded
into your IRDB, your handset follows a prescribed list of carriers and
network types to be used, largely predicated on who your home carrier
has roaming contracts with.  If your home carrier doesn't have a roaming
contract with the only signal your handet can 'see', then despite any
signal strength indicator, that signal cannot be used by you at that time.

I think I've got all that in the proper order - if not, someone will
have to jump in here and let us both know.

Signature

jer  email reply - I am not a 'ten'  ICQ = 35253273
"All that we do is touched with ocean, yet we remain on the shore of
what we know."  -- Richard Wilbur

Joseph - 01 Jan 2004 04:40 GMT
>I've got a question regarding GSM network selection. Let's say I
>subscribe to provider T. There are towers belonging to provider T,
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>providers' signals my phone can "see"? Does each tower broadcast a list
>of networks it provides service for, or is it more complicated than that?

If T-Mobile has a roaming agreement with ATTWS you will be able to use
their network.  You will only be able to use ATTWS' service if
T-Mobile has a roaming agreement with ATTWS.  If there's no roaming
agreement you cannot use ATTWS' service.  It's highly unlikely that
you will have a roaming agreement in place if both carriers cover
territory in the same area.  It's not impossible, but it's highly
unlikely.

It's likely that your phone will be able to "see" any network that's
in your area.  It's likely however that you will only be allowed to
use your carrier or another carrier *if* both your home carrier and
the other carrier have roaming agreements in place.  Your service is
probably set up to choose the home network first and if the home
network is not available it will search for other networks that you
have permission to roam on.

>Next question: in the above example, My phone can see two towers that it
>is capable of making calls through. How does the phone decide which
>tower to use? Does it use the strongest signal, or will it prefer a
>tower belonging to my provider if available?

It *should* try to go for the tower of your home carrier first.  If it
does not find a signal it may look for another signal.  Depending on
which phone you have the behavior may vary.  Some phones such as
certain models of Samsung would look for any network and try to
connect to it.  Unfortunately that strong network may be barred from
your use and the only use you can make of that network is to call 911
as your carrier does not have a roaming agreement with that carrier.
Other phones such as Nokia will just show no network at all (blank
screen) but you still are able to dial 911.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
          remove NO from .NOcom to reply
 
Sign In
Join
My Latest Posts
My Monitored Threads
My Blog
My Photo Gallery
My Profile
My Homepage

Start New Thread
Enable EMail Alerts
Rate this Thread



©2009 Advenet LLC   Privacy Policy - Terms of Use
This website includes both content owned or controlled by Advenet as well as content owned or controlled by third parties.