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Cellular Phone Forum / Providers / T-Mobile / September 2007

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Internet access through phone

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Steve Sobol - 24 Sep 2007 15:13 GMT
So I got pissed off at Motorola about their idiocy while repairing my
PEBL, and got a sweet deal from T-Mo on a Nokia 6133. The 6133 is
EDGE-capable and at Victorville's T-Mo store there are a few phones
that are dummy phones, but most of them are turned on and working, and the
EDGE indicator was lit on a few of them. So I'm wondering what kind of data
plan I can get for the phone; this is a phone, not a Blackberry or Sidekick.

I understand there's T-zones, T-Mo Web and full Internet access. Anyone know
what the pricing is? I assume I can't do the "phone as modem" thing without
having full Internet access.

Also, are there any deals on Internet access from phone + T-Mo HotSpot?

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Steve Sobol, Victorville, California     PGP:0xE3AE35ED
"Drench yourself in words unspoken / Live your life with arms wide open
Today is where your book begins / The rest is still unwritten"
    - Natasha Beddingfield

BruceR - 24 Sep 2007 19:21 GMT
Just get TMo Web for $5.99/mo, install Opera Mini and you'll have full
access.

> So I got pissed off at Motorola about their idiocy while repairing my
> PEBL, and got a sweet deal from T-Mo on a Nokia 6133. The 6133 is
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> Also, are there any deals on Internet access from phone + T-Mo
> HotSpot?
Steve Sobol - 24 Sep 2007 19:15 GMT
> Just get TMo Web for $5.99/mo, install Opera Mini and you'll have full
> access.

I'd like to use the phone as a modem. I'd also like to get the HotSpot service
because where it's available, it should be quite a bit faster. EDGE is only
around ISDN speeds, right? (128-144Kbps)

Signature

Steve Sobol, Victorville, California     PGP:0xE3AE35ED
"Drench yourself in words unspoken / Live your life with arms wide open
Today is where your book begins / The rest is still unwritten"
    - Natasha Beddingfield

Steevo@my-deja.com - 25 Sep 2007 05:49 GMT
>Just get TMo Web for $5.99/mo, install Opera Mini and you'll have full
>access.

I got that to work after hacking the razr some time ago.

I can't get it to work on a Motorola V555 with the sim from the razr.
The V555 has edge, the razr doesn't, which is why I would like to get
it working.

Any ideas?  As far as I can tell the web session I have on the V555 is
exactly identical to the one on the razr.  You may recall the web
session menu was suppressed on the razr, I had to re-enable it to get
that to work.  That is not necessary on the V555.

I'd also like to tether with bluetooth to my laptop. How well will
that work on the $5.99 tmobile web plan?
Todd Allcock - 25 Sep 2007 21:13 GMT
> I'd also like to tether with bluetooth to my laptop. How well will
> that work on the $5.99 tmobile web plan?

Fine.  I do it via my WinMo phone.  You just need to setup a DUN
connection on the laptop and configure the 216.155.165.50:8080 proxy
in the browser's connection options.

Remember that any web app (IM, for instance) you want to use has to
be able to be configured to use the proxy, and you can't download
anything over 1MB in size.  But, as I've said, it makes a cheap,
effective backup connection for when I'm stuck in a hotel without
free internet.

Signature

"I don't need my cell phone to play video games or take pictures
or double as a Walkie-Talkie; I just need it to work.  Thanks for
all the bells and whistles, but I could communicate better with
ACTUAL bells and whistles."      -Bill Maher 9/25/2003

Todd Allcock - 24 Sep 2007 23:10 GMT
> I'm wondering what kind of data
> plan I can get for the phone; this is a phone, not a Blackberry or Sidekick.
>
> I understand there's T-zones, T-Mo Web and full Internet access. Anyone know
> what the pricing is? I assume I can't do the "phone as modem" thing without
> having full Internet access.

Yes, actually you can.

The three plans have different restrictions.

First, there's T-Zones.  It's free, and _almost_ worth the price!  It
allows WAP access to your account info, and T-Mo's
ringtones/wallpapers "store."  No "real" web access.  

Next up the food chain is "T-Mobile Web" for $5.99.  (Confusingly, "T-
Zones" was originally the name for this plan back when it was $2.99
then $4.99, so T-Mo Web is often referred to as "T-Zones" by old-
timers on places like HowardForums.)

This is the plan that non-PDA phones are supposed to have.  It allows
unlimited e-mail (POP/IMAP/SMTP) and unlimited "mobile web" access.
(What the "mobile web" is, is anyone's guess!)  You can reach any
http/https website, (whether or not your phone can actually render
them properly is another matter!) but any file downloads have to be
under 950k.  This is enforced by use of a proxy server- all internet
ports on T-Mo Web plans are closed, (including 80, the http port)
EXCEPT e-mail POP/IMAP/SMTP ports (25, 143, etc.)  All web/WAP
browsing is tdone through a T-Mo-supplied proxy server at
216.155.165.50:8080.  

Attempts to download larger files (>950k) return a "file too large"
error.  Because of the proxy, all functions except e-mail and
browsing are blocked (no FTP, no streaming audio or video, no SSH, no
VPN, no NNTP, no VoIP, etc.)

You CAN tether your PC or PDA to your phone with the T-Mo Web plan,
as long as you set the proxy server in your browser's connection
options.  (And, with e-mail ports open, POP/IMAP e-mail works fine.)  

Don't tell T-Mo, but I personally use T-Mo Web, even on my PDA phone
(recently T-Mo hasn't been allowing PDA phone owners to sign up for it,
but I've been using it for a long time, prior to buying a Windows-
Mobile PDA phone.)

Frankly, at EDGE speeds, I'm not likely to waste time downloading
anything over 1MB anyway! ;-)  I don't use mobile internet enough to
justify a more expensive plan, but it comes in handy even for
tethering my laptop when I find myself stuck in a hotel without free
WiFi.


> Also, are there any deals on Internet access from phone + T-Mo HotSpot?

Funny you should ask- the last plan, "Total Internet," was just
reduced in price from $29.99 to $19.99/month.  It has no filesize
limitation (it doesn't use the proxy- you connect directly to the net)
and includes unlimited access to all T-Mo WiFi hotspots.  (It's
important to note that you're allowed to use ANY WiFi device with
your Hotspot access- not just a WiFi enabled phone.  So, for
$19.99/month you'd get EDGE on your Nokia and WiFi on your laptop.)
It's the plan PDA phones like mine are supposed to use, but again, I
find the $5.99 plan more than adequate.  

Given that the Hotspots plan sells for $19.99/month by itself (with a
year comittment!) the "Total Internet" add-on is a great value, since
you can add it on, or drop it from, your T-Mo voiceplan at will.  

I didn't mention (since it's not really a "plan") that T-Mo still
allows CSD connections (Circuit Switched Data.)  It's dial-up GSM
data using your own dial-up ISP.  It's limited to 9.6k (yep, good old
9600 baud!) but there's no charge- calls count against your plan
minutes (or "free" minutes like weekends.)  While excruciatingly slow
for web browsing, it's ok for e-mail and WAP browsing (or NNTP text
group access!)  I've even used it for accessing my desktop remotely
(which is blocked on my $5.99 plan!) when I needed a large file I
forgot to bring on vacation.  Downloading it over CSD would've taken
forever, so I remote-accessed my PC and e-mailed it to myself as an
attachment, since the 950k T-Mo Web file download limit doesn't apply
to e-mail.

Let me know if you have any questions- I'm sure what I just typed was
much clearer in my head than it came out on the page!

Signature

"I don't need my cell phone to play video games or take pictures
or double as a Walkie-Talkie; I just need it to work.  Thanks for
all the bells and whistles, but I could communicate better with
ACTUAL bells and whistles."      -Bill Maher 9/25/2003

Mike Schumann - 25 Sep 2007 03:09 GMT
Thanks for the excellent overview of the options.  This is the 1st time I've
ever seen exactly what the different service offerings included in technical
detail.

Mike Schumann

>> I'm wondering what kind of data
>> plan I can get for the phone; this is a phone, not a Blackberry or
[quoted text clipped - 82 lines]
> Let me know if you have any questions- I'm sure what I just typed was
> much clearer in my head than it came out on the page!

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Steve Sobol - 25 Sep 2007 06:46 GMT
> Funny you should ask- the last plan, "Total Internet," was just
> reduced in price from $29.99 to $19.99/month.  It has no filesize
> limitation (it doesn't use the proxy- you connect directly to the net)
>  and includes unlimited access to all T-Mo WiFi hotspots.

So I can get phone-as-modem _and_ wifi for the same price as I used to be
able to pay jusst for wifi. That's a no-brainer.

> important to note that you're allowed to use ANY WiFi device with
> your Hotspot access- not just a WiFi enabled phone.  So, for
> $19.99/month you'd get EDGE on your Nokia and WiFi on your laptop.)

I like.

> Let me know if you have any questions- I'm sure what I just typed was
> much clearer in my head than it came out on the page!

No, when we eventually have more money to spend on wireless I planned on
signing up for HotSpot anyhow, and this is a better deal. Only works for one
of the phones on our account, I assume? (the "phone-as-modem" feature, that
is)

Signature

Steve Sobol, Victorville, California     PGP:0xE3AE35ED
"Drench yourself in words unspoken / Live your life with arms wide open
Today is where your book begins / The rest is still unwritten"
    - Natasha Beddingfield

Todd Allcock - 25 Sep 2007 21:15 GMT
> I planned on
> signing up for HotSpot anyhow, and this is a better deal. Only
> works for one
> of the phones on our account, I assume? (the "phone-as-modem"
> feature, that is)

Yes, unfortunately.  But again, once you've snagged the Hotspots
account on one line, you could probably get by with the $5.99 plan on
your other line(s) for on-phone data and limited EDGE tethering.
There's no reason you couldn't "share" the Hotspots access as long as
only one family member used it at a time.  (I assume a "multiple
login" attempt would simply be rejected.)

Having said that, I'd love to see a "family" data plan someday, like
they currently offer for texting.  Even so, it's still a good deal.
Unlimited EDGE/hotspots with no voice plan (like for a datacard) is
$49.99, but instead you could add a data card to your family plan by
adding a new voice line (that you'd never use) for $10, and adding
the Total Intenet to that line for $19.99 and setup a laptop data
card with unlimited EDGE and hotspots for $29.99!  

If T-Mo ever gets 3G up and running, I'd consider ditching my home
DSL line and adding a bluetooth 3G phone.  I'd run the PC through the
phone's 3G data and run my home phones off of a BT "dock-n-talk"
adapter rigged to the same phone for a total of $30/month extra
instead of the $75/month I now pay Qwest for a landline and 1.5M DSL!

Signature

"I don't need my cell phone to play video games or take pictures
or double as a Walkie-Talkie; I just need it to work.  Thanks for
all the bells and whistles, but I could communicate better with
ACTUAL bells and whistles."      -Bill Maher 9/25/2003

Steve Sobol - 25 Sep 2007 22:43 GMT
> Yes

No big deal, I am the only one who would connect through the cell phone
anyhow. I just wanted to make sure I had my facts straight.

> adding a new voice line (that you'd never use) for $10, and adding
> the Total Intenet to that line for $19.99 and setup a laptop data
> card with unlimited EDGE and hotspots for $29.99!  

I don't think I need that.

I just need to verify that EDGE is available in Victorville.

Signature

Steve Sobol, Victorville, California     PGP:0xE3AE35ED
"Drench yourself in words unspoken / Live your life with arms wide open
Today is where your book begins / The rest is still unwritten"
    - Natasha Beddingfield

Cyrus Afzali - 25 Sep 2007 16:05 GMT
>> Also, are there any deals on Internet access from phone + T-Mo
>HotSpot?
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
>year comittment!) the "Total Internet" add-on is a great value, since
>you can add it on, or drop it from, your T-Mo voiceplan at will.  

I am asking all T-Mobile Blackberry users to contact customer care and
complain about the fact that we don't have this right. I fully
understand that the reason they are giving it to users with a wi-fi
enabled device, which on the Blackberry line only includes the Curve,
is because it allows T-Mobile's Hotspots to easily authenticate who
they are.

But it also seems to me they should be able to set up some system so
that customers like myself, who have enterprise-level Blackberry
devices, would also be able to have the full Hotspot capability, since
we're at the same ARPU level.

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Todd Allcock - 25 Sep 2007 20:41 GMT
> >Given that the Hotspots plan sells for $19.99/month by itself (with a
> >year comittment!) the "Total Internet" add-on is a great value, since
> >you can add it on, or drop it from, your T-Mo voiceplan at will.  
>
> I am asking all T-Mobile Blackberry users to contact customer care and
> complain about the fact that we don't have this right.

While TI (Total Internet) won't appear as an option on the my.t-
mobile.com website, you should be able to just call them to add it to
your line.  The only "screwibng" BB customers get is that TI doesn't
include "Blackberry" e-mail for BIS or BES, just "regular" POP/IMAP e-
mail, so you'd also have to add the new $9.99 BB e-mail-only plan.  

> I fully
> understand that the reason they are giving it to users with a wi-fi
> enabled device, which on the Blackberry line only includes the Curve,

> is because it allows T-Mobile's Hotspots to easily authenticate who
> they are.

Not really- they don't authenticate by device (for web acces, that is-
Hotspots @ Home UMA voice service is authenticated by device.)  For
internet WiFi use a browser login page.  Your username is your 10-
digit phone number, and your password is the last 4 of your SSN.

> But it also seems to me they should be able to set up some system so
> that customers like myself, who have enterprise-level Blackberry
> devices, would also be able to have the full Hotspot capability, since
> we're at the same ARPU level.

True- unfortunately the problem is lack of BIS/BES so you'd need both
TI and BB e-mail plans ($29.98) instead of the $19.99 Blackberry e-
mail and web plan.  

Signature

"I don't need my cell phone to play video games or take pictures
or double as a Walkie-Talkie; I just need it to work.  Thanks for
all the bells and whistles, but I could communicate better with
ACTUAL bells and whistles."      -Bill Maher 9/25/2003

Cyrus Afzali - 27 Sep 2007 14:43 GMT
>> >Given that the Hotspots plan sells for $19.99/month by itself
>(with a
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
>include "Blackberry" e-mail for BIS or BES, just "regular" POP/IMAP e-
>mail, so you'd also have to add the new $9.99 BB e-mail-only plan.  

Right, which means I'd have to pay extra either way to get hotspot
access when I'm already generating a high enough revenue point for
them. This is simply a policy change that they could enact if they
wanted to, but heretofore have chosen not to.

>> I fully
>> understand that the reason they are giving it to users with a wi-fi
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
>internet WiFi use a browser login page.  Your username is your 10-
>digit phone number, and your password is the last 4 of your SSN.

Then why won't they give Blackberry users this right? I tried calling
T-Mobile and got in run around hell. Basically, they bullshitted me
about why they can't do it.

>> But it also seems to me they should be able to set up some system so
>> that customers like myself, who have enterprise-level Blackberry
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>TI and BB e-mail plans ($29.98) instead of the $19.99 Blackberry e-
>mail and web plan.  

Right, and I refuse to pay anymore for something I should be getting
given that I'm at the same revenue level as the aforementioned users.

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Todd Allcock - 27 Sep 2007 21:21 GMT
> Right, which means I'd have to pay extra either way to get hotspot
> access when I'm already generating a high enough revenue point for
> them. This is simply a policy change that they could enact if they
> wanted to, but heretofore have chosen not to.

To be fair, the "Total Internet" price drop is only one week old.  I
wouldn't be too hard on them just yet!

> Then why won't they give Blackberry users this right? I tried calling
> T-Mobile and got in run around hell. Basically, they bullshitted me
> about why they can't do it.
Because the Total Internet p
an does't support BIS/BES (from what I understand.) and the Total
Internet plan includes hotspots.

Sure, it'd be nice if everything was fully customizable, but I
suspect there are systemic issues involved.

Here's a crazy idea- why not just switch your data plan from the BB
plan to TI and see if it works?  TI supports the wap.voicestream.com
APN, which, IIRC, is what the BBs use for web access.

> Right, and I refuse to pay anymore for something I should be getting
> given that I'm at the same revenue level as the aforementioned users.

But you're not at the same _service_ level- you have access to
BIS/BES servers, which TI users do not.  Charging extra for that is
sort of standard in the industry.  

Signature

"I don't need my cell phone to play video games or take pictures
or double as a Walkie-Talkie; I just need it to work.  Thanks for
all the bells and whistles, but I could communicate better with
ACTUAL bells and whistles."      -Bill Maher 9/25/2003

Cyrus Afzali - 28 Sep 2007 15:38 GMT
>> Right, which means I'd have to pay extra either way to get hotspot
>> access when I'm already generating a high enough revenue point for
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>To be fair, the "Total Internet" price drop is only one week old.  I
>wouldn't be too hard on them just yet!

I suppose. Thing is, I'm in a service-oriented business and my clients
expect me to jump when they want me to jump. Although T-Mobile as a
rule is very good at customer service, telecom companies expect people
to be proud to be customers of theirs in many cases.

>> Then why won't they give Blackberry users this right? I tried
>calling
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>Sure, it'd be nice if everything was fully customizable, but I
>suspect there are systemic issues involved.

If all that's involved in logging into a hotspot is username and p/w,
then it would just involve adding the same thing to BES users'
accounts as they've done for everyone else. I do suspect part of the
problem is some of our information is handled by RIM, since they
actually have the e-mail infrastructure. And if that's the case, then
they could have told me that. What irks me is the fact that either no
one is knowledgeable enough to know that or receiving bullshit answers
as to why I'm not getting it.

>Here's a crazy idea- why not just switch your data plan from the BB
>plan to TI and see if it works?  TI supports the wap.voicestream.com
>APN, which, IIRC, is what the BBs use for web access.

Because then the push e-mail wouldn't work.

>> Right, and I refuse to pay anymore for something I should be getting
>> given that I'm at the same revenue level as the aforementioned users.
>
>But you're not at the same _service_ level- you have access to
>BIS/BES servers, which TI users do not.  Charging extra for that is
>sort of standard in the industry.  

No, not really. Because my device literally can't use a standard POP
server, I have access to different infrastructure. A Blackberry would
be useless on a standard Internet plan and with a POP server because
all the infrastructure for it is centralized.

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