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Cellular Phone Forum / Providers / Verizon / April 2005DST Complaint
Man, am I pissed! The time on my LG VX6100 is set by Verizon's network. (Ever noticed you can't set the time on your phone?) I assumed Verizon would change to Daylight Savings time at 2:00 a.m. this morning, the time at which DST officially begins. (Technically, we are supposed to go from 1:59 to 3:00.) I had my alarm set for 6:45 am, and yes, I use my phone as my alarm sometimes. (And yes, Verizon, some of us actually do work on weekends!) Guess what - Verizon didn't switch to DST until 6:00 am standard time, at which time we skipped from 6 a.m. directly to 7 a.m. So 6:45 NEVER HAPPENED and my alarm never went off! (I know this because I happened to wake up right around the time my alarm *should have gone off* - thank god - and after a few moments of confusion, realized my phone was still on standard time!) F***ing idiots - what a half-assed thing to do! > Man, am I pissed! > [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > F***ing idiots - what a half-assed thing to do! The time is set by the network on your phone when the phone is powered up. It will continue to work off of that initial setting until the phone is turned off and, once again, powered up. Bill, I don't know if I agree with that. My phone automatically went to the new time and I haven't turned it off/on, reset, etc... In fact, when I picked it up in the morning, it had already switched to the new time. Hogarth does seem a little harsh with his/her comments, however. We hear countless reminders to 'set the clock forward' from the television, radio, friends, family, etc... In fact, I had vowed if one more person reminded to move my clock forward, I was going to punch them in the mouth. For you to call Verizon names because they didn't change the time 'on time' doesn't seem right. Name calling will never get you anywhere, you stupid idiot. (grin) -Xy >> Man, am I pissed! >> [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > It will continue to work off of that initial setting until the phone is > turned off and, once again, powered up. In news:bxU3e.4458$x4.2346@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net "Xyloc" <Xyloc@hotmail.com> wrote: > Bill, I don't know if I agree with that. My phone automatically went to > the new time and I haven't turned it off/on, reset, etc... In fact, when [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > mouth. For you to call Verizon names because they didn't change the > time 'on time' doesn't seem right. All the reminders in the world won't help if the device won't LET you set the time yourself and you have to rely on "the system" to do it the right way. All my U*IX boxes at work all flipped at the right time. > Name calling will never get you anywhere, you stupid idiot. (grin)  SignatureBert Hyman St. Paul, MN bert@iphouse.com > In news:bxU3e.4458$x4.2346@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net "Xyloc" > <Xyloc@hotmail.com> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > > Name calling will never get you anywhere, you stupid idiot. (grin) (OP here, in all my name-calling, stupid idiot glory) Shame on me for trying to simplify my life and have fewer gadgets to depend on. I spent the night with friends and didn't want to bring an alarm clock with me or ask them to wake me up. Oh, no - wait a minute. I did bring an alarm clock! One on which Verizon assumed responsibility for setting the time. I was aware that daylight savings time was happening, thank you, Xyloc (you idiot <g>) but had no control over setting the time on my phone. If Verizon assumes responsibility for that, well, then --- they're responsible, aren't they? All of my networked computers have always updated to DST on their own. I assumed - mistakenly - that the one on the nightstand would, too. Anyway, as far as when the clock updates to DST, my LG VX6100 updated sometime between 5:54 PST and 7:03 am PDT. During those nine minutes, I didn't power cycle the phone or make or receive any calls. It was sitting here on the table next to me the entire nine minutes. I looked at it and it said 5:54, and a little later it said 7:03. But, yeah, I'll admit I may have over-reacted a bit. I hadn't had my coffee yet. And I was still steaming from a bad experience with Verizon earlier this week: I noticed that the battery cover was missing from my phone. (Must have popped off when I dropped it in a parking lot a few days before.) I stopped into my local Verizon store and said I needed a new battery cover. The two guys behind the counter looked at each other for a second, then looked back to me. "Sorry," the guy said. "We can't get 'em." And he pulled HIS phone out of his pocket, to show me the battery duct taped into place! Sheesh! > > > Bill, I don't know if I agree with that. My phone automatically went to > > > the new time and I haven't turned it off/on, reset, etc... In fact, when [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > > <snip> I don't ever remember Verizon stating that they'd guarantee any type of phone-clock accuracy. Notan > Shame on me for trying to simplify my life and have fewer gadgets to > depend on. No actually, shame on you for depending on something to be accurate when you have absolutely no control over it's accuracy! I don't care how accurate the cell provider thinks their netowkr time is, I go by the time *I* have set on *MY* watch, at all times. I've never relied solely on a cell phone to tell me the time and expect it to be 100% accurate, 100% of the time. There are too many variables involved. What if the battery dies (did you bring your charger with you)? What it a freak storm blows down all nearby cell towers, rendering the phone useless as EITHER a phone or an alarm clock? Or worse yet, what if I accidentally set the phone on vibrate and never hear the alarm? I think it's really unfortuante that handset makers have even put an alarm clock function into their phones. When you get down to it, a cell just isn't a good alarm clock, no matter how you slice it. SignatureE-mail fudged to thwart spammers. Transpose the c's and a's in my e-mail address to reply. Bert Hyman <bert@iphouse.com> spewed: > All the reminders in the world won't help if the device won't LET you > set the time yourself and you have to rely on "the system" to do it > the right way. Bah. Having a new phone, knowing you can't set the time manually, needing to get up at a certain time, and NOT KNOWING if the phone would switch to DST at the proper time - all of those things would tell a sensible person to not rely on the phone - and get a flippin' alarm clock that you can set yourself! *laugh* FWIW, my 6100 changed over shortly after 2am. ^_^ SignatureVisit My Site: http://www.rubbertoe.com > The time is set by the network on your phone when the phone is powered up. > It will continue to work off of that initial setting until the phone is > turned off and, once again, powered up. It appears to depend on what kind of phone you have. My Audivox CDM9900 switched on its own sometime during the night. My wife's Motorola V60i didn't switch until we turned it off and back on. >It appears to depend on what kind of phone you have. My Audivox CDM9900 >switched on its own sometime during the night. My wife's Motorola V60i >didn't switch until we turned it off and back on. My Samsung a310 switched in the night. Hunter Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well-preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting "...holy sh.t...what a ride!" >> The time is set by the network on your phone when the phone is >> powered up. It will continue to work off of that initial setting [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > CDM9900 switched on its own sometime during the night. My wife's > Motorola V60i didn't switch until we turned it off and back on. My wifes LG VX 6thousand something and my VX4500 both remained on Standard time until each of us accessed some function on the phone. I turned on an alarm as my vacation was over, and my wife got a call. After each of us doing our things, the phones were onm the new time. This was somewhere in the early evening yesterday. None of our phones were powered off. > The time is set by the network on your phone when the phone is powered up. > It will continue to work off of that initial setting until the phone is > turned off and, once again, powered up. I had my phone on and the time did change without it being powered off. I don't have any idea when but it happened before I up this morning which was around 7:30 am EDT. SignatureCharles >> The time is set by the network on your phone when the phone is powered >> up. >> It will continue to work off of that initial setting until the phone is >> turned off and, once again, powered up. Since your phone will change time when you move from one time zone to another when it's on it doesn't make sense to me that you would have to power it off and back on to change to DST. Don > Since your phone will change time when you move from one time zone to > another when it's on it doesn't make sense to me that you would have to > power it off and back on to change to DST. When you move from one time zone to another, you are changing towers, and thus your phone has to re-register, and thus, as a sideeffect, you get the new time zone. It's "not expecting" to change time zones without moving. (But they really ought to fix this!) On Sun, 3 Apr 2005 11:18:43 -0400, "Bill Hughes" <billybobh3@adelphia.net> chose to add this to the great equation of life, the universe, and everything: >> Man, am I pissed! >> [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] >It will continue to work off of that initial setting until the phone is >turned off and, once again, powered up. That is not correct. The time is set by the network whenever it communicates with the phone. This can be at a power-up, making or receiving a call, or just moving from one area to another. The last few times, it didn't update the time until I did something to cause the phone to contact the network. This time, I was surprised to find that it had actually changed *before* it was supposed to -- I looked at it and the time was 2:38. I then checked my watch and it was still 1:38. Technically, there should not have been a 2:38 this morning, but my phone gave it to me. I have to wonder if maybe they did the change for the whole country, or at least the whole eastern half, at the same time, 2:00 Eastern, and that the rest of the country, or at least the Central time zone, got screwed by the East Coast Mentality. My suggestion to the OP (if he ever calms down enough to read these replies) is to set a calendar event for 1:59. Wake up and watch it switch to the new time. If it doesn't, call *611 and hang up after it connects, then check the time again. If the calendar event never goes off, they changed it early like they did for me and you have nothing to worry about. SignatureDavid Streeter, "an internet god" -- Dave Barry http://home.att.net/~dwstreeter Remove the naughty bit from my address to reply Expect a train on ANY track at ANY time. "The Greeks always know when you're desperate; they pick up your clueless-American vibe through osmosis (or, as the Greeks say, ``tipiyokti'')." - Dave Barry Bill Hughes wrote on [Sun, 3 Apr 2005 11:18:43 -0400]: >> Man, am I pissed! >> [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > It will continue to work off of that initial setting until the phone is > turned off and, once again, powered up. So, why does the time on my phone change as I go across time zones etc without turning it off? > Bill Hughes wrote on [Sun, 3 Apr 2005 11:18:43 -0400]: > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > So, why does the time on my phone change as I go across time zones etc > without turning it off? To say that the phone gets the time from the network when your phone is powered up is only part of the truth. The phone sets the time to the network anytime the phone registers with the tower, which does happen at power on. It also happens when a phone call is made, and when the tower you are connected to changes. Thus when you are traveling and change time zones, the phone will switch to a tower in the new time and get the updated time. Rich >Guess what - Verizon didn't switch to DST until 6:00 am standard time, >at which time we skipped from 6 a.m. directly to 7 a.m. So 6:45 NEVER [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >alarm *should have gone off* - thank god - and after a few moments of >confusion, realized my phone was still on standard time!) Switch to cingular! Their phones will only update if you power off and re-power the phone! (Assuming the network has NITZ in the area.) - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - > Switch to cingular! Their phones will only update if you power off > and re-power the phone! (Assuming the network has NITZ in the area.) Hell with Cingular my wife and I never had the network set our phones right! They were always an hour off. Of course this was from a company who had the world's worst signal! At home..... dropped calls, due to poor signal. At the store we shop at most... dropped calls, due to poor coverage.... On my wife's route to/from work..... yeah.. you guessed it... dropped calls due to poor coverage. Some friends and I went out to breakfast this morning. They have two Cingular GSM phones and we had two Verizon phones with us. None updated automatically. Place a phone call or receive a phone call --> forced the update, but not before. Although I didn't test, I would guess power-cycling the phones would have also worked. -Dan PS: Each phone seems to deal with time zones differently as well. My Nokia's on Verizon update immediately when crossing time zones. My Kyocera may not update for several hours or until I make or receive a call. Signature======================= Oregon and the Pacific Northwest http://cell.uoregon.edu -- > Man, am I pissed! > [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > F***ing idiots - what a half-assed thing to do! > Man, am I pissed! > [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > F***ing idiots - what a half-assed thing to do! Seems to me a prudent man wouldn't even think of relying on something so tentative to wake his sorry a.s up if waking up at a certain time was important. Buy an alarm clock-- they're $6 at Wal-Mart. But having screwed up, it's laughable how you try to externalize the blame-- rather than bellying up to the bar and admit your own stupidity;-) You're the same sort as the jerk who sued McDonalds for scalding his privates after driving off with a Styrofoam cup of hot coffee between his thighs and was "surprised" when it spilled and burned him... Cleburne I happened to be awake at the 2 AM switchover and while my phone didn't switch exactly at that time, it did switch, without having to turn it off, shortly thereafter. > Man, am I pissed! > [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > F***ing idiots - what a half-assed thing to do! The clock on a CDMA phone is set only when the phone registers with a tower. This is done: 1) When you power on. 2) When you move to a different tower. 3) At the end of a call or text message. 4) When the tower tells the phone to. 5) When the software in the phone is in the mood to do so. Registration requires the phone to transmit, which takes power, which drains the battery. For (4), the network will often ask roamers to re-register regularly. For (5), entries in the roam list are assigned priorities, and if you are currently on anything less than a system with the highest priority (usually a VZW system), the phone will periodically wake up and look around for a system with higher priority than the one it is currently on. When it picks one it may well register with it, even if it is the one it was one before. If you are already on the highest priority system, there is nothing "better", so why waste the battery? Also, since CDMA requires the tower and the phone to be tightly synchronized with each other, eventually the phone will have to re-register in order to resynchronize its clock (the internal one, not the display), but that is up to the phone's manufacturer when they write the phone's software. That could be hours, depending on how accurate the phone's clock hardware is. If VZW really wanted to be "nice", they could program the system to ask phones to re-register when DST kicks in (or out). With time-dependent applications being common on phones now, that would really make sense. >The clock on a CDMA phone is set only when the phone registers with a >tower. This is done: [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] >the phone's software. That could be hours, depending on how accurate the > phone's clock hardware is. I thought it was part of the CDMA protocol that the system will poll each phone it believes to be active after a certain amount of time passes without any activity (I think I read 30 minutes maximum) to confirm that the phone is still on and so that the system will know what cell to direct a call to. SignatureDavid Streeter, "an internet god" -- Dave Barry http://home.att.net/~dwstreeter Remove the naughty bit from my address to reply Expect a train on ANY track at ANY time. "We'd like to offer our affection as a gift by the white bird on sky to every genuinely go the same may together with you. This is our only requite to you." - in-flight magazine of Xiamen Airlines > I thought it was part of the CDMA protocol that the system will poll each > phone it believes to be active after a certain amount of time passes > without any activity (I think I read 30 minutes maximum) to confirm that > the phone is still on and so that the system will know what cell to direct > a call to. I was thinking about that too. But the system knows where you registered. If it hasn't heard from you, either (1) you are still on in the same cell or (2) the phone died suddenly without de-registering (system crash, whatever), or (3) you moved to where there is no coverage at all. If you moved to another tower, you would have registered there. So it can conclude that if you are anywhere, you are where you last registered. There could possibly be some sort of light-weight "keep alive" ping, short of registration, which you and I are thinking of, but this wouldn't reset the clock. I have noticed that if one of my phones is turned off and I call it, the call immediately goes to VM, so the system clearly knows not to even try looking for it. After looking at Verizon's website, I see that the OP was not doing anything that Verizon themselves didn't recommend. Take a look at the following press release. http://news.vzw.com/news/2005/04/pr2005-03-31.html So I decided to send the following to Verizon and see what kind of response I get: "In a recent press release concerning the switch to daylight saving time (note that's it's saving (with no 'S') unlike your press release which used the incorrect plural), you mentioned that we could set the alarms on our phones to ensure that we would get up and arrive to places on time. How can you recommend this? Most phones do not update their time until a call is placed or the phone is power cycled. I know of one person who woke up late because they did exactly what you recommended and set their alarm on their phone, but the time didn't adjust correctly at 1:59 am to 3:00 am. Before you release more press releases like this you may want to make sure that what you suggest to your customers will actually work." Rich > Man, am I pissed! > [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > F***ing idiots - what a half-assed thing to do! Or try this device to correct the matter: http://tinyurl.com/4n6fv > The time on my LG VX6100 is set by Verizon's network. (Ever noticed you > can't set the time on your phone?) I can on my Audiovox 9900. |
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